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Board change

Former Community Member
Former Community Member
If a EICR has been carried out recently 4 weeks ago, if you change the board would you be required to carryout testing on all circuits or can you reference the EICR.
  • Former Community Member
    0 Former Community Member

    Alcomax:


     


     the circuits have been in use for around 30yrs .... It could be due a full re-wire if the circuits are that sort of age.



    Why at the age of 30 is the wiring suspect enough to be condemned? Is this the "Logan's Run" approach to work generation?


    In my opinion, a board change requires a full test and classed as a new installation



    A distribution board change is a replacement , and does not "renew the installation". A marketing ploy, maybe, for the unscrupulous.

     




    I admit that there are installations that are still to be deemed as "OK", even though they could be 50 odd years old, but as I said, it depends entirely on the condition of the installation and part of the reason why I would want to do a full test on it to make sure nothing has broken down or is on the verge of it - Even though everyone loves going back to site 3 months down the line because the lights keep tripping and it was "your fault"...


    As for my reasoning for a full test on a new DB - BS7671 specifies that a minor works certificate "should not be used for replacement of distribution boards or similar items" (appendix 6, page 466 - 18th Edition). So you're not doing a minor works certificate, and you're not doing a condition report - that whittles down the options a bit. (See Page 464 of BS7671 18th Edition IET Wiring Regulations) -



    ELECTRICAL INSTALLATION CERTIFICATE
    Notes for the person producing the Certificate:  


    1. The electrical Installation Certificate is to be used only for the initial certification of a new installation or for an addition or alteration to an existing installation where new circuits have been introduced, or the replacement of a consumer unit/distribution board.






    You also need to confirm that the board you're supplying has the appropriate equipment for the supply characteristics and the correct operating and protective factors for the installation provided. Hardly a "marketing ploy" to make sure you're doing something properly.

  • 0

     the circuits have been in use for around 30yrs .... It could be due a full re-wire if the circuits are that sort of age.



    Why at the age of 30 is the wiring suspect enough to be condemned? Is this the "Logan's Run" approach to work generation?


    In my opinion, a board change requires a full test and classed as a new installation



    A distribution board change is a replacement , and does not "renew the installation". A marketing ploy, maybe, for the unscrupulous.
  • 0

    Timeserved:

    Hi Jewsbury,

    i was thinking of just carrying out the live tests as the circuits have been in use for around 30yrs along with a couple of IRT tests on some of the radials to gain a good overall assesment. Didn't think that the dead tests would be relevant here has these are existing circuits which have previously been energised and then to reference the EICR that's just been carried out for R1+R2 reading if needed. Will gain further advise from NIC EIC to see what they think is appropriate too, will be interesting...




    Regulation 643.1 - last paragraph is intended to ensure safety of the person carrying out the test, and anyone else that might be affected, and also


    The EICR was valid on the day of the test, and I guess there's an argument that some things haven't changed (provided you're sure they haven't).


    However, the connections at the CU have changed, and therefore at least some tests (at the very least, this would be some form of continuity of protective conductors and insulation resistance tests) are necessary as a result.


    Agree with the point already made about validation of ADS.

  • 0

    SScho:

    IMHO, and EICR is only as good as the electrician who tested it on the day - just like an MOT. You can trust it to a certain extent but it should be taken with a pinch of salt.




    With such a recent EICR, I don't think that it need be repeated entirely, but I think that the Zs values for each circuit should be confirmed.

  • Former Community Member
    0 Former Community Member

     the circuits have been in use for around 30yrs




    This is part of the reason why you would want to do a full system test on it. It could be due a full re-wire if the circuits are that sort of age.


    In my opinion, a board change requires a full test and classed as a new installation or at the very least, a minor works certificate with any deviations from the regs and notes all mentioned in there as well. Testing one or two circuits just doesn't cut it in my opinion as you'll have removed all the circuits, changed all the breakers, moved the cables around and disturbed the system as a whole. It also depends how large the installation is and over all condition of it.



    I hope you mentioned to the client what the board change involves as it's a lot more involved than just swapping one thing out for another - if you start coming across readings that aren't acceptable then you could have a lot of fault finding or rewiring on your hands which is of course an added cost to the client. If you swap a board out and include 30mA RCBOs then you could have the issue of not being able to turn them on at all if there's an issue.


    IMHO, and EICR is only as good as the electrician who tested it on the day - just like an MOT. You can trust it to a certain extent but it should be taken with a pinch of salt.


  • Former Community Member
    0 Former Community Member
    Hi Jewsbury,

    i was thinking of just carrying out the live tests as the circuits have been in use for around 30yrs along with a couple of IRT tests on some of the radials to gain a good overall assesment. Didn't think that the dead tests would be relevant here has these are existing circuits which have previously been energised and then to reference the EICR that's just been carried out for R1+R2 reading if needed. Will gain further advise from NIC EIC to see what they think is appropriate too, will be interesting...
  • 0
    You'd need to test to ensure that your new work doesn't contain any defects (e.g. your c.p.c. terminations aren't faulty, no conductors snapped after the extra wiggling or insulation hasn't been damaged by shoving the old wires through the openings in the new steel CU case) - you can't rely on any previous tests to do that.


    You might also have to show that the max Zs suits the new protective devices - e.g. if replacing a 15A BS 3036 on an old 5s disconnection time circuit with B16 on a non-RCD circuit max acceptable Zs drops by over 2 Ohms - previous results might help with that (e.g. by testing to a point nearer the CU to test your work and using the previous results to confirm the loop impedance at the far end of the circuit).


      - Andy.

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