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The future of residential building electrical installations

Arran Cameron
This is a spin-off from the discussion What is the best way to wire ceiling lights.


What do you think is the future of residential building electrical installations in 20 to 30 years time? Will they in modern and modernised houses be significantly different from what they are today or will they most likely be barely changed from what they are today?


Will consumer demand be a driving force for change or will electricians only make changes from the status quo in order to comply with updated wiring regs?
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    Time to move on from tariffs.


    Aaron obviously doesn’t like my prediction that we will have a version of the French Tariff Bleu with agreed standing charges based on an agreed maximum demand for each property.


    Another inevitability is that electric car owners will have to start paying road tax to contribute to building and maintaining roads as a standing charge or by having a GPS tracker fitted to their car to record usage to pay as they go, otherwise as the use of petrol, diesel and LPG fuelled vehicles declines the costs of building and maintaining toads and bridges will have to fall onto general taxation or tolls will have to be reintroduced on the Severn Bridges and at other locations where there have never been tolls. The tolls may be called congestion charges, but they are effectively the same thing, having to pay to use a toad or bridge.


    Andy Betteridge
  • 0
    Use toads! that`s a good idea Andy, more sustainable.

    Sorry I could not resist.


    Seriously though yes your points are valid, as with most things in life trade offs and anomolies appear despite all the good intents
  • 0
    It could be argued that back in the old days before water meters that fixed rate water bills were a standing charge. The water bill paid for the cost of water treatment and maintaining the pipeline network but the water itself was free.


    I'm not opposed to standing charges, and a system of standing charges with a kWh allowance where a certain number of kWh are 'free' either at any time or at certain designated times may well be a better system where an increasing amount of electricity is produced by renewable sources.


    A current cap will end up becoming a system where customers end up paying for something that they very rarely use. I have a (theoretical) current cap of 80A which is more than I would normally need to use but it's there if I need it (like if temporary electric heaters are installed if my boiler breaks down during a massive freeze up) and every kWh is charged for by the supplier.
  • 0
    I was going to move on from tariffs, however I could point you in the direction of This gas tariff


     
  • 0

    Sparkingchip:

    Time to move on from tariffs.


    Aaron obviously doesn’t like my prediction that we will have a version of the French Tariff Bleu with agreed standing charges based on an agreed maximum demand for each property.



    Well I am somewhat persuaded by the argument. So instead of returning home, putting a load of laundry in the washing machine, another in the drier, starting the dinner, and turning on the dishwasher (if you want to eat off clean plates today), and to cap it all, having a quick shower; the use of high-consumption goods will have to be staggered.


    I can also see the force of the argument that if you want a larger share of the DNO's network, you should have to pay for it.


    The counter argument is that we seem to get by on our couple of amps per house.
    Another inevitability is that electric car owners will have to start paying road tax to contribute to building and maintaining roads as a standing charge or by having a GPS tracker fitted to their car to record usage to pay as they go, otherwise as the use of petrol, diesel and LPG fuelled vehicles declines the costs of building and maintaining toads and bridges will have to fall onto general taxation or tolls will have to be reintroduced on the Severn Bridges and at other locations where there have never been tolls. The tolls may be called congestion charges, but they are effectively the same thing, having to pay to use a toad or bridge.

    I couldn't agree more! It does seem to be a reasonable public policy to impose low taxes on EVs because for most people, the extra capital charge makes them uneconomical and without the early adopters, little or no progress would be made.


    The problem comes when you have to squeeze a couple of EVs within your household's cap.
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    Chris Pearson:


    I can also see the force of the argument that if you want a larger share of the DNO's network, you should have to pay for it.

    There is the overarching question whether customers should pay for the kWh (the energy) or pay for the amps (creating load peaks).


    I don't rule out the concept of smart throttling of current in order to reduce excessive load peaks. Customers will have a 100A maximum current limit but will only be guaranteed current up to a certain limit, say 60A, and if the current exceeds this value when the power network is heavily loaded then a signal will be sent down the mains to switch off individual circuits or the entire house.
  • 0

    Arran Cameron:




    Chris Pearson:


    I can also see the force of the argument that if you want a larger share of the DNO's network, you should have to pay for it.

    There is the overarching question whether customers should pay for the kWh (the energy) or pay for the amps (creating load peaks).


    I don't rule out the concept of smart throttling of current in order to reduce excessive load peaks. Customers will have a 100A maximum current limit but will only be guaranteed current up to a certain limit, say 60A, and if the current exceeds this value when the power network is heavily loaded then a signal will be sent down the mains to switch off individual circuits or the entire house.


    The supply to most, if not all, domestic properties are based on a 40% assumed maximum demand anyway so if it was possible for very house in the country to consume its full 100A we'd probably have power station brown-outs. So automatic load sheading happens now as we've seen just recently.


    Legh 

  • Former Community Member
    0 Former Community Member
    Whilst "standing charges" for energy have been decried in some of the previous posts, no one appears to object to the phoneline rental nor the TV package service from above that could be £60/month.....................


    Whatever next, paying an annual fee to allow you to use a vehicle on the road?!


    Regards


    BOD


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    The existing distribution network will probably melt if everyone tries to draw 60 amps, it’s four times what the system is designed to deliver to each house.


    So that requires a massive infrastructure upgrade that means ripping up millions of mile of roads to replace cables, a bigger challenge than replacing the gas grid with plastic pipework as more homes have mains electricity than mains gas.


    The answer to to even out loads with wet heating systems having buffer tanks as heat storage, storage radiators, batteries and do on, then regulate the appliances in use to even out consumption to use what is available through the existing distribution network without upgrading it.


    Andy Betteridge
  • 0

    perspicacious:

    Whilst "standing charges" for energy have been decried in some of the previous posts, no one appears to object to the phoneline rental nor the TV package service from above that could be £60/month.....................


    Whatever next, paying an annual fee to allow you to use a vehicle on the road?!


    Regards


    BOD


     




    Or the twelve month gym membership fee paid by direct debit that seemed like a good idea at the time, but in reality you have not been to the gym for five weeks.


    Andy Betteridge 

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