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18TH EDITION AMD 2

John Peckham
Big day today the DPC for 18TH Edition AMD 2 was published on the British Standards web site this morning.
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    Chris Pearson:

    As far as I can see, no supporters of AFDD here, so how do we respond with maximum effect?


    Take it up with CENELEC and the IEC.  I understand that the IET's hands are tied.


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    John Peckham:



    AFDDs compulsory for high current circuits in dwellings.


     


    Where did you get "high current" from?  If anything the current is "fixed" but I think that sentence in the DPC needs rewording!


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    Chris Pearson:

    What will be a problem will be new circuits e.g. for an extension or that shower squeezed into a corner somewhere. 


     




    They will not be required for shower circuits, which is a good thing because I am already having issues adding RCD protection to existing shower circuits.


    Last night I ordered online some Europa Double Pole B40/30 mA Type AC RCBOs and 2-Mod enclosures for replacing existing Fused Switches in crowded locations, They will probably be posted directly to me from the manufacturer rather than going via the wholesaler who has taken the order from me. That’s how I am having to work, getting direct deliveries from manufacturers for various bits of kit, because you won’t generally be able to buy anything that will do the job from a local wholesalers branch.


    Anyway the showers are resistive loads over 32 amps, so the Europa Double Pole B40/30 mA Type AC RCBOs will still be okay to use.


    Andy Betteridge 


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    I think it is going to be impossible to have a proper debate about having a compulsory requirement to install arc fault detection devices on this IET forum, because we will not find anyone prepared to support the proposal.


    So I will throw the challenge out, who is prepared to present an argument in favour of the proposal?


    Andy Betteridge
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    Dutch of the Elm:
    Chris Pearson:

    As far as I can see, no supporters of AFDD here, so how do we respond with maximum effect?


    Take it up with CENELEC and the IEC.  I understand that the IET's hands are tied.




    If that is the case, why have a public consultation? I suppose because they have to.

     



    mapj1:

    I must admit I am concerned by the introduction of AFDDs . There is no agreed means to test them and very little evidence that they actually do much to save lives.

    What would be very helpful would be to know why the changes have been proposed. If it is a matter of falling in line with CENELEC and IEC, so be it. If there is good engineering or scientific evidence, let us know so that we may make a properly reasoned response.
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    This morning I cannot find the DPC, anyone got a link which works?

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    From Chris Pearson;

    “What would be very helpful would be to know why the changes have been proposed. If it is a matter of falling in line with CENELEC and IEC, so be it. If there is good engineering or scientific evidence, let us know so that we may make a properly reasoned response.”


    Would it be churlish to suggest that commercial interests have tentacles in these committees? As I understand it, certain manufacturers have invested a clean fortune in the research and development of these devices and they now demand pay off!
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    Regarding my comment about 2-mod enclosures, they don’t have neutral bars.


    Edit- so you need a device with four terminals rather than three with a flying lead for the neutral, such a most AFDD have.


    So you cannot fit a single pole RCBO or an AFDD in a 2-mod enclosure alongside an existing fused switch, fuse board or consumer unit, because there is nowhere to terminate the neutral flying lead to transition to sheathed cable to get back into the existing equipment, so you need a garage CU or similar and generally they are just too big to fit into the required position.


    Then before you know it you need to be replacing everything or trying to compromise on what is ideal.


    Andy Betteridge
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    lyledunn:

    From Chris Pearson;

    “What would be very helpful would be to know why the changes have been proposed. If it is a matter of falling in line with CENELEC and IEC, so be it. If there is good engineering or scientific evidence, let us know so that we may make a properly reasoned response.”


    Would it be churlish to suggest that commercial interests have tentacles in these committees? As I understand it, certain manufacturers have invested a clean fortune in the research and development of these devices and they now demand pay off!


    Or there are shareholders in all the committees. I mean, if there was a meaningful statistic as to how many lives these devices save why is it so hard to find. And from a developed nation, not the third world electrical installs and boards that Americans install, that look like the 40 year old stuff we rip out


  • 0
    The IET illustrated This article online with a consumer unit that by their own reckoning will cost over £1500.

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