gkenyon said:

We are talking a range of 5-20 times that energy in the storage systems that are going into dwellings in general. However, these batteries are also permanently wired and charging/discharging constantly (which is even different to UPS operation where for long periods they are topped up with charge and monitored for voltage etc.).

I have a car battery (which lives directly beneath bottom of the RH rear passenger) with a capacity of 110 Ah at 12 V, so 1.32 kWh so I take the point. However, they are constantly being charged and discharged, especially with vehicles which stop the engine at traffic lights, etc.

There is indeed the risk of a significant short circuit current: 920 A CCA is comparable with the Ze at home.

For the amount of energy in batteries in a given space, it would be hard to beat an old diesel boat.

Chris Pearson said:

However, they are constantly being charged and discharged, especially with vehicles which stop the engine at traffic lights, etc.

Quite different ... the main use is to start the engine, After that, they are charged at constant voltage ...

But then again, maybe ... or not ...

• most of it is outdoors
• away from buildings (at least when the charge/discharge is happening)
• Explosive gases are lighter than air (as above)
• electrolyte is dangerous ... but worst-case leaks on the floor outside
• Arc-fault dealt with (in modern cars ... although not always older cars) by fuse at or very near the battery
• etc
• etc.

Quite different ... the main use is to start the engine, After that, they are charged at constant voltage ...

Not in my other half's car (so called mild hybrid) - there's an extra battery that's charged by regenerative breaking when slowing down, and discharged not only on autostart but when accelerating (to aid the IC engine). And again it's under one of the passenger seats.

   - Andy.

AH, I see what you mean. We have a stop-start battery in one of our vehicles. I'm actually surprised at the length of time it has lasted without showing degradation, compared to a more traditional lead-acid.

Having said, that, on most journeys it acts just like a traditional starter battery, only needing to start the vehicle once, then recharge. The stop-start doesn't get used much at all.

Every hybrid I've encountered has an auxillary lead acid battery - I think the main battery tends to be on a contactor so it's isolated when the engine is off.

My old Honda Insight had a tiny aux battery. I often would pull over to take a call, switch off the engine but leave my electrics on. Then 30 minutes later I'd be getting the jump leads out.

Of course infuriating as it is, there's a good safety reason why manufacturers segregate things like this. Should note that nearly every petrol or diesel car has the fuel tank underneath the seats too - often the fuel pump is right underneath the back seat where the children are.

gkenyon said:

I'm actually surprised at the length of time it has lasted without showing degradation, compared to a more traditional lead-acid.

Many hybrids seem to only use their starter motor for cold starting. Once oil pressure is acheived and at operating temperature they can usually start the engine with torque from the electric drive. This is far less wear and tear - drive motors are nearly always brushless - AC, Switch reluctance or BLDC etc.

A 12V DC starter motor will always be a service part - it's remarkable that the commutators last as long as they do. Hence for recharging the battery most cars use an alternator which only need a small commutator for the field coils.

So should I register if i intend to watch virtually? I take that's a yes but I didn't wan't to inadvertantly register and take an person place.

My battery bank consists of four 6 volt batteries in series to give 24 volts in total, for a UPS. The fault current is probably a couple of thousand amps. Protection is a 60 amp  BS88 fuse in the middle of the three series connections. House service fuse type, in an all insulated holder. Charging current is a few amps, discharge current about 45 amps maximum, but usually much less.

Yes please, if you follow the registration process on the link above, you'll be given the opportunity to select either the virtual event or the physical. Let me know if you experience any problems. A link for the YouTube streaming will be sent out to registrants the day before. Thanks, Kerrie-Ann

This might be slightly off topic but still worth a read

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-7621/