Looking back, with the benefit of my PRA and Mentoring experience, I could probably have achieved Chartership (if I'd been interested then) at the age of 27 given good advice, and could have sailed through at the age of 29. As my career had had a few false starts by that point, the age range 24-25 seems perfectly reasonable.


Simon mentions Chartered Manager. The CMI magazine regularly describes 25 year old company directors for significant businesses. That's just as challenging (for the examples I'm thinking of) as CEng - in many ways more so.


Personally I see three reasons why we don't see more 25 year old CEngs, sort of as alluded above:

1. Lack of interest within that age group

• Lack of understanding of the wider professional role amongst early career engineers

• Poor advice from employers, particularly the idea that you must be a manager (or at least project manager) before you can apply

I'm going to let others debate point 1, I know why I wasn't interested until my mid 30's but everyone's different.


Point 3 I know the IET is trying to address, but it shouldn't underestimate the huge amount more it needs to do!


Point 2 is the one I'm particularly interested in, and I think ties in well with Roy's thoughts. As I repeatedly say, one of the huge benefits of the professional registration process is - or should be - that it makes the candidate think about their holistic role as an engineer. As I've just posted somewhere else, engineering operates within the wider society, and showing that engineers can think beyond the screen in front of them and consider their colleagues, customers, and beyond is what makes a fully rounded professional engineer. Which is what the registration grades capture. Wouldn't it be good if as well as recognising 50 year old engineers for what they've learned through bitter experience (and through getting it badly wrong at everyone's expense) we encouraged graduate engineers to start developing these wider skills from day 1 of industrial experience? 


Or, to flip it around, for the graduate who immediately decides to dive straight into project management, making sure that they make a continuous effort to keep in touch with the technology they are managing? 


I suppose that supports the IMechE model of continuous review and benchmarking against the relevant professional reg criteria over a period of 2-3 years up to registration, which could start immediately post graduate or (I assume) during undergrad work experience or during an apprentice programme. So we can end up with 25 year old engineers who are innovative, have a sound technical basis, but are also actually able to talk to (and listen to) someone outside their own discipline! (Is the IMechE model I'm think of "MPDS"?)


Now there's real value the IET could add to the world of engineering. Personally I think the formal IMechE model is too cumbersome for many employers, particularly small employers. However, far more effort in promoting Mentoring / PRA services to very early career engineers should have significant benefits for everyone - engineers, employers, customers and wider society. 


Coming back to Simon's point of "how many managers are CMgr" - in my experience very few. Most of those I meet are consultants who need that extra accreditation. (Of course it might just be that they're the ones that go to CMI meetings - it's great fun at these watching the consultants all hoping to find clients and just finding other consultants! I have an evil sense of humour sometimes.) A somewhat similar tale to my experience of CEngs. Which is a shame - for both groups - as the rest are missing an opportunity to look outside the narrow confines of their day job and gain wider skills and knowledge. At whatever age. 


Here's a dream. The norm to be that all engineers / technicians hold one of the professional registration grades at the age of 25.


Cheers,


Andy

Looking back, with the benefit of my PRA and Mentoring experience, I could probably have achieved Chartership (if I'd been interested then) at the age of 27 given good advice, and could have sailed through at the age of 29. As my career had had a few false starts by that point, the age range 24-25 seems perfectly reasonable.


Simon mentions Chartered Manager. The CMI magazine regularly describes 25 year old company directors for significant businesses. That's just as challenging (for the examples I'm thinking of) as CEng - in many ways more so.


Personally I see three reasons why we don't see more 25 year old CEngs, sort of as alluded above:

1. Lack of interest within that age group

• Lack of understanding of the wider professional role amongst early career engineers

• Poor advice from employers, particularly the idea that you must be a manager (or at least project manager) before you can apply

I'm going to let others debate point 1, I know why I wasn't interested until my mid 30's but everyone's different.


Point 3 I know the IET is trying to address, but it shouldn't underestimate the huge amount more it needs to do!


Point 2 is the one I'm particularly interested in, and I think ties in well with Roy's thoughts. As I repeatedly say, one of the huge benefits of the professional registration process is - or should be - that it makes the candidate think about their holistic role as an engineer. As I've just posted somewhere else, engineering operates within the wider society, and showing that engineers can think beyond the screen in front of them and consider their colleagues, customers, and beyond is what makes a fully rounded professional engineer. Which is what the registration grades capture. Wouldn't it be good if as well as recognising 50 year old engineers for what they've learned through bitter experience (and through getting it badly wrong at everyone's expense) we encouraged graduate engineers to start developing these wider skills from day 1 of industrial experience? 


Or, to flip it around, for the graduate who immediately decides to dive straight into project management, making sure that they make a continuous effort to keep in touch with the technology they are managing? 


I suppose that supports the IMechE model of continuous review and benchmarking against the relevant professional reg criteria over a period of 2-3 years up to registration, which could start immediately post graduate or (I assume) during undergrad work experience or during an apprentice programme. So we can end up with 25 year old engineers who are innovative, have a sound technical basis, but are also actually able to talk to (and listen to) someone outside their own discipline! (Is the IMechE model I'm think of "MPDS"?)


Now there's real value the IET could add to the world of engineering. Personally I think the formal IMechE model is too cumbersome for many employers, particularly small employers. However, far more effort in promoting Mentoring / PRA services to very early career engineers should have significant benefits for everyone - engineers, employers, customers and wider society. 


Coming back to Simon's point of "how many managers are CMgr" - in my experience very few. Most of those I meet are consultants who need that extra accreditation. (Of course it might just be that they're the ones that go to CMI meetings - it's great fun at these watching the consultants all hoping to find clients and just finding other consultants! I have an evil sense of humour sometimes.) A somewhat similar tale to my experience of CEngs. Which is a shame - for both groups - as the rest are missing an opportunity to look outside the narrow confines of their day job and gain wider skills and knowledge. At whatever age. 


Here's a dream. The norm to be that all engineers / technicians hold one of the professional registration grades at the age of 25.


Cheers,


Andy