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Is it time to ask UKPN to consider if HVDC works better in future networks ?

I have been wondering about the big line losses that are necessary in HV transmission systems , HVDC can nearly halve these to 4% but all the new renewable technology of generation and of storage is mostly DC . From the interconnector its all AC cant really change that , but if the electric car becomes reality then all the chargers will be converting DC to AC (in some quite high flows of electricity from low to full of some batteries) , so we are perhaps saying that the electric car will bring more line losses , it might not be that bigger deal, but if we electrolyse water to Hydrogen and Oxygen then the conversion losses from AC to DC will add up , so it has to be better to just transmit in DC , if we could generate in DC and I think we have brushless three phase generators now then we generate and transmit efficiently to the new big users of electricity . In the USA we see generation plant to city interconnector , I don't think they use a balancing grid , as cities are so far apart . I know any design has its problems but with the new uses of electricity any generation system will have to match (or think about the new denands) , its perfrectly possible to have designed and balanced generator to interconnector supply , but a shared transmission grid obviously allows you to arrange supply generator and demands in a different way .

One use I thought about is for a village to say have a battery and the line to it may only charge the battery once a week as DD line to DC battery and that electricity that is then spare can be used to say make Hydrogen ? It could give a completely different and more efficienct system ? Not really worked much on HV systems , but I can sort see a sketch of how it could work as a network . If only a short distance to a big demand then might as well use AC , but a 1000mw supply to an interconnector losing 7% over its life time is a lot .
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  • I think if you look at future demands , electric cars and water electrolysis a HVDC network does make sense , but at the moment the engineers that can show how it will work from HVDC transmission to AC distribution arnt getting the opportunity to show why it works better. The other option of course is to dispense with the UHV transmission system completely and generate AC locally to the interconnectors , which would require very different thinking but certainly could be efficient , I wouldn't like to do the maths on losing the UHV transmission system as there are some very good arguments for having a national grid for transmission from large generation centres. Renewables have come along pretty well , way beyond what I thought was possible 10yrs ago. I think solar PV will probably lose out in all but the high regular sun places or those who want to go off grid , because distributed electricity is so cheap with the right selection of generation. Hydro will probably move towards green hydrogen by splitting water as 500mw and over are not really common and some have caused environmental problems , but wind still causes grid management problems even though £30 per MW raw price is possible, and I think wind could go to green hydrogen also , at 1/3 rd of nuclear per MW it could provide quite cheap hydrogen .

    When you see the figures for Hydrogen production , just even for Ammonia production let alone the Hydrogen car, the numbers are mind boggling.
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  • I think if you look at future demands , electric cars and water electrolysis a HVDC network does make sense , but at the moment the engineers that can show how it will work from HVDC transmission to AC distribution arnt getting the opportunity to show why it works better. The other option of course is to dispense with the UHV transmission system completely and generate AC locally to the interconnectors , which would require very different thinking but certainly could be efficient , I wouldn't like to do the maths on losing the UHV transmission system as there are some very good arguments for having a national grid for transmission from large generation centres. Renewables have come along pretty well , way beyond what I thought was possible 10yrs ago. I think solar PV will probably lose out in all but the high regular sun places or those who want to go off grid , because distributed electricity is so cheap with the right selection of generation. Hydro will probably move towards green hydrogen by splitting water as 500mw and over are not really common and some have caused environmental problems , but wind still causes grid management problems even though £30 per MW raw price is possible, and I think wind could go to green hydrogen also , at 1/3 rd of nuclear per MW it could provide quite cheap hydrogen .

    When you see the figures for Hydrogen production , just even for Ammonia production let alone the Hydrogen car, the numbers are mind boggling.
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