Shock Likelihood at Switch.

Is it just me, but I cannot see why an unsatisfactory could not have been given and once the remedial work had been carried out (apparently the minor works of fitting some insulated switches), a satisfactory issued?


Is it because one wants to be seen as "nice"?


Regards


BOD

What code for a wooden back box? 


Regards,


Alan.

perspicacious:

Is it just me, but I cannot see why an unsatisfactory could not have been given and once the remedial work had been carried out (apparently the minor works of fitting some insulated switches), a satisfactory issued?


Is it because one wants to be seen as "nice"?

Yes, but the customer may not want remediation, especially if the appearance is everything. ?

Alan Capon:

What code for a wooden back box? 

Are we really talking about a wooden back box, or just a wooden surround?


I have installed those wooden sockets and switches. Now then, how can I be polite? I wasn't impressed by the quality. ?

If the installation is old enough to have no CPC in the lighting circuit, then it's certainly old enough to have wooden back boxes on the light switches.

perspicacious:
The installation certificate should say that the lack of a CPC is a non-compliance, to quote the ESF Best practice guide I linked to above:
10.9. On completion of the work a record of any non-compliances, including the lack of protective conductors on the lighting circuits, must made in the Comments on existing installation section of the electrical installation certificate issued to cover the work

I just checked the ESF guidance on un-earthed Class 1 fittings and their guidance is C2 and an unstatisfactory report. 


Aren't these two mutually incompatible?


Regards


BOD

 

Plastic light switches without a CPC is a non-compliance and should be noted on the installation certificate as such.


Installing a replacement consumer unit to provide RCD protection is an improvement, so should not be discounted out of hand, but it doesn’t mean that class 1 metal light switches on a circuit without a CPC are considered safe.


So coding class 1 metal light switches as a level 2 risk remains reasonable.


The last time I had to deal with this issue was whilst undertaking inspection and testing in a HMO preparing an EICR for submission to the council for renewal of the HMO licence, I managed to pull in a CPC in a couple of places that resolved many issues and replaced some metal light switches with plastic switches. The stupid part of it was that when the house was converted to a HMO a new consumer unit was installed along with a LD1 smoke alarm system that meant all the floors were lifted to install the new circuit, but the lighting circuit was not replaced at the same time, some people are just stupid.


Andy B.

IMHO, the risk from a metal light switch that is not earthed is small, but NOT SO SMALL as to be considered satisfactory. Earth them, or replace with plastic. I do not see how testing the insulation resistance will help, it is presumably satisfactory now as no electric shocks are being reported. The risk is that a single fault in either the switch or the wiring thereto could result in a danger.


It is in my view SOMETIMES acceptable to tolerate small risks when the costs or trouble involved in eliminating such risks are substantial, but in view of the cheap and simple solution of plastic light switches, THIS risk should not be allowed to remain.

Let's put an end to this mass hysteria. It appears to be catching and getting out of control..


The facts.


1. Flat owner installs two new chrome plated metal light switches on an old circuit with no C.P.C. in original wooden boxes.


2. I  produce an E.I.C.R. and state that the switches need earthing or changing to all insulated types. I code this as a C3, "Improvement recommended".


3. Some say that the code should have been a C2, "Potentially dangerous, urgent remedial action required". This would have made the overall assessment of the whole installation "unsuitable" for continued  use.


The ball is now in the flat owner's court and it is up to him to act to rectify any deficiencies.


End of.


Z.

3. Some say that the code should have been a C2, "Potentially dangerous, urgent remedial action required". This would have made the overall assessment of the whole installation "unsuitable" for continued  use.


And what is wrong with declaring this?


Regards


BOD

The two metal plate light switches with insulated plastic rocker switches comply with 416.1 with basic insulation. The back boxes are wooden. Live parts will only become visible due to destruction of the light switch.

Is the back of metal frontplate insulated somehow or is it exposed to the wiring within the backbox?


   - Andy.