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TT systems and RCD trip times

Hi all


Just reading through the disconnection times in the regs and noticed something I've never thought of before.


On table 41.1 there is a note under the table that states that the disconnection times of a TT system can be the same as a TN system if disconnection is achieved by an OCPD and bonding is in place. However, I've not come across a TT system with a Ze low enough where only an OCPD can be used. The lowest Ze I've seen was 20 ohms.


Therefore:

On a TT system the disconnection times are 1 second and 0.2 of a second. Reg 411.3.2.2 & 411.3.2.4.

You would normally use an RCD for fault protection due to earth rod resistance causing higher than max Zs on final circuits as well as additional protection. Reg 411.5.3.


However, according to the OSG 11.2 and 11.3 the max allowable time to trip for a 61008 and 61009 can be up to 300ms (or, as stated, less then 300ms so 299.99ms).

If you are using RCBOs on circuits requiring 30mA protection and a selective type on the incoming it is 150 to 500ms on circuits without the RCBOs, so even worse.


This will mean it may not comply with the disconnection times. If you test the RCD and it trips within the 200ms it will comply but the fact that the BS standards allow for a longer time means that technically it does not comply.


(On a side note it seems strange that the older BS4293 RCD specifications do have a max trip time of less that 200ms, although it would still be the same issue with the selective type).


Parents
  • Thanks for your replies


    davezawadi:

    I wasn't a little confused about TT. Everything you said is what I had written but didn't go into the detail. 


    ebee:

    What you mentioned is what I was refering to. 


    I don't know if I had not explained it properly and you have misunderstood what I was getting at.

    I have reread what I had written but I can't see any other way of explaining it. I have to admit it took a while to write it out in the first place.

    Apologies if I haven't made the issue clear. It was the actual RCD and RCBO max trips times compared to the allowable trip times that's the issue.


    lyledunn:

    I think I see what your saying.

    I presume the 500 ohms for the 100mA RCD is taken from table 41.5 on page 64.

    I understand what you are saying as this is the same with 300 or 500mA RCDs and their max allowable Ra from that table doing the calculation you still get a current that will effect a x2 trip time at 150ms so within the 0.2 TT trip time.

    Regarding table 3A it is giving x1, x2 & x5 tripping times for RCDs. However, most testers do not allow x5 testing above 100mA. When I've tried it set to 300 it won't test.

    Most testers also don't test at x2 which is what would be needed to make sure that the RCD did trip within the time you have mentioned.


    It seems there is more to it than just the stated trip times mentioned in the OSG.

    The only issue is testing the RCD at x2 to make sure it trips within 150ms.





Reply
  • Thanks for your replies


    davezawadi:

    I wasn't a little confused about TT. Everything you said is what I had written but didn't go into the detail. 


    ebee:

    What you mentioned is what I was refering to. 


    I don't know if I had not explained it properly and you have misunderstood what I was getting at.

    I have reread what I had written but I can't see any other way of explaining it. I have to admit it took a while to write it out in the first place.

    Apologies if I haven't made the issue clear. It was the actual RCD and RCBO max trips times compared to the allowable trip times that's the issue.


    lyledunn:

    I think I see what your saying.

    I presume the 500 ohms for the 100mA RCD is taken from table 41.5 on page 64.

    I understand what you are saying as this is the same with 300 or 500mA RCDs and their max allowable Ra from that table doing the calculation you still get a current that will effect a x2 trip time at 150ms so within the 0.2 TT trip time.

    Regarding table 3A it is giving x1, x2 & x5 tripping times for RCDs. However, most testers do not allow x5 testing above 100mA. When I've tried it set to 300 it won't test.

    Most testers also don't test at x2 which is what would be needed to make sure that the RCD did trip within the time you have mentioned.


    It seems there is more to it than just the stated trip times mentioned in the OSG.

    The only issue is testing the RCD at x2 to make sure it trips within 150ms.





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