This discussion is locked.
You cannot post a reply to this discussion. If you have a question start a new discussion

Farm earthing arrangements.

009a7dbbf62372ab469269cf2662d114-huge-20200425_145756.jpg


Some years ago I started doing electrical work at a farm, originally the farm buildings and house were both connected to the DNO earth terminal.


I altered it so that the farm buildings are TT , but left the house connected to the DNO earth terminal. The possible issues are that there is a steel clad switch fuse enclosure for the house inside a wooden cupboard in the farm workshop and the SWA cable for the house passes through the ground immediately adjacent to the farm building. But there was no physical connection between the house and farm earthing arrangements.


It had been like that for a few years as the house has not had any alterations at all, just a few repairs. So the house installation is effectively exactly the same as it was when the house and the farm buildings were thirty years ago and connected up as a new installation by the DNO.


However (you knew there was going to be a however!) a couple of years ago PV panels were installed on the farm building roof and the installers used the DNO and house earth terminal rather than the farm buildings earth terminal, despite the PV system being in and on the farm buildings and it having storage batteries that feed back into the both installations as they share a meter; and the storage batteries act as a supply to emergency lighting in the farm buildings when the installation is off-grid.


I am now reviewing the earth arrangements, the house is empty and needs tidying up, thirty two lights need replacing and odd repairs, there won't be any alterations it is just replacing fittings and replacing MCBs in the split load consumer unit with RCBOs to give additional RCD protection in the house. 


I will leave it at that and not express my thoughts, as it will be more interesting to see what your thoughts are rather than trying to get you to consider mine.


Comments please. 


Andy B
Parents
  • I've seen that DNOs can have rather poor detail about parts of their network, and I realise that they've inherited the network, moved to computers, etc.  But I'd have thought there'd be occasional inspection (10yr?) to check the basics at LV transformers, e.g. soundness of main electrode, wire to it, pole, etc., which would be the opportunity to check that there's a record and that it fits the fact.  Do they have a chosen policy or obligation of checking through the system, or is it only a reactive service after complaints?


    Regarding PNB vs PME vs etc:  one could go on forever ... so I won't get into several of the aspects that tempt me - e.g. about mutual exclusivity or not, of PNB/PME. But I will just observe (not relevant to the WPD system in the OP, but to mapj1's point)  that I find it a strange idea to consider a system with a combined N+E downstream of the nearest-to-source earth electrode to be other than PME, even if it's deemed PNB by virtue of some distance from the source to that earth.  Even if the supplier has only the one electrode, then as soon as they've provided an "earthing terminal" to this combined N+E at an intake,  that customer could then or later end up bonding it to things that in effect are good electrodes. The broken-conductor shock-danger aspect of this multiple earthing of an active conductor is what mapj1 mentioned. And even without a break, farm animals outside a very well bonded area may be upset by small voltages.  I'd want complete separation of N+E for all points downstream of the first earthing, in order not to consider PME 'issues' to be relevant. (When did they stop having to get the home secretary's or suchlike's permission for more than one earth on a neutral? Some countries have been very fussy about this: for Germany I've heard the power companies felt very unfortunate for having come after the telephone/telegraph ones, which then complained about any earth currents. I think that was the main concern with getting permissions in the early days of PME.)

Reply
  • I've seen that DNOs can have rather poor detail about parts of their network, and I realise that they've inherited the network, moved to computers, etc.  But I'd have thought there'd be occasional inspection (10yr?) to check the basics at LV transformers, e.g. soundness of main electrode, wire to it, pole, etc., which would be the opportunity to check that there's a record and that it fits the fact.  Do they have a chosen policy or obligation of checking through the system, or is it only a reactive service after complaints?


    Regarding PNB vs PME vs etc:  one could go on forever ... so I won't get into several of the aspects that tempt me - e.g. about mutual exclusivity or not, of PNB/PME. But I will just observe (not relevant to the WPD system in the OP, but to mapj1's point)  that I find it a strange idea to consider a system with a combined N+E downstream of the nearest-to-source earth electrode to be other than PME, even if it's deemed PNB by virtue of some distance from the source to that earth.  Even if the supplier has only the one electrode, then as soon as they've provided an "earthing terminal" to this combined N+E at an intake,  that customer could then or later end up bonding it to things that in effect are good electrodes. The broken-conductor shock-danger aspect of this multiple earthing of an active conductor is what mapj1 mentioned. And even without a break, farm animals outside a very well bonded area may be upset by small voltages.  I'd want complete separation of N+E for all points downstream of the first earthing, in order not to consider PME 'issues' to be relevant. (When did they stop having to get the home secretary's or suchlike's permission for more than one earth on a neutral? Some countries have been very fussy about this: for Germany I've heard the power companies felt very unfortunate for having come after the telephone/telegraph ones, which then complained about any earth currents. I think that was the main concern with getting permissions in the early days of PME.)

Children
No Data