This discussion is locked.
You cannot post a reply to this discussion. If you have a question start a new discussion

Why Use an Earth Rod when a Disc will do?

A new type of earth electrode.

ConduDisc Demonstration - Earth Rod Alternative - YouTube



Z.
  • Not very impressive 300 ohms is a bit high maybe if its buried deeper it will be better think ide stick to rods if given a choice
  • Kelly Marie Angel:

    Not very impressive 300 ohms is a bit high maybe if its buried deeper it will be better think ide stick to rods if given a choice


    If it's a consistent Zs reading of say 300 Ohms, it will easily satisfy the requirements of Table 41.5 up to 100mA operating current R.C.D.s,  including the popular 30mA type. Of course I do not know if you radio people need a lower resistance to true earth for other reasons.


    Z.


  • I wonder how well it responds to high currents like lightning surges. For comparison one of the problems of the Marconite concrete 'Ufer' electrodes can be cracking of the concrete after such an event.

    To be honest of you are digging a hole you may as almost well dig a long thin one and put a rod in either laying flat or on the diagonal.

    (or bent into a 'J to get a connection you can inspect)


    Beware of very shallow burial, both drying out and freezing solid have the same effect of removing most of the conducting ions - you want to be deep enough it does not do that.


    Radio earth arrangements fall into two cases - a sort of safety earth under  a balanced antenna where there is almost no ground current, and here an electrical grade earth electrode may do, or a for a monopole antenna 'working against ground' where for every amp of RF going up the antenna, an amp also comes out of the ground. In this second case  we do not especially need a low DC earth impedance, but a we need to keep the RF touch voltage down, so we do need a good capacitance to earth so a chicken mesh or radial pattern of wires that can even be insulated is often used as the 'counterpoise' to the active element. Long earth wires ( as in a significant fraction of a wavelength long)  - imagine the electrons doing a sort of click clack newtons cradle thing and bouncing back and forth - can form unexpected resonators, and that needs additional consideration as the current and voltage are not the same at different points on the line and so the effective connection impedance is (sometimes very) RF frequency dependant

    Mike.


  • The greater surface area of the disc would be an advantage - but I'd not be happy about shallow burial. Both drying and freezing can increase the resistance of soil very considerably. How deep you need to go to get to a layer that's consistently damp and never freezes will depends a lot of the location. In general you'd probably have to be at least 0.5 deep to avoid freezing - probably more like 0.75m in some areas (the water regs require a minimum depth of 750mm for water pipes in the UK to avoid freezing). Damp is trickier as it depends a lot more on the kind of soil (sand on a hilltop rather than peaty clay in a valley bottom) - but them that know seem to suggest that if you hit a layer that offers a resistance of 200Ω or less you're likely (in the UK) to have it a layer that'll be reasonably stable over the seasons.


    The idea of a "flat" electrode rather than a rod isn't new - I'm sure I've seen a recommendation from years ago that suggested using a buried "plate" as an electrode - positioning it 'on edge' as it were rather than flat, so it wouldn't shelter the soil below it from moisture.


    There's also the issue with close-to-surface electrodes of significant voltages being imposed on the surface - which can of themselves be hazardous (especially to those with bare feet or 'long wheelbase' animals.)


    So while this disc seems a good idea in principle, to make an adequately robust installation I think you'd have to dig a reasonably deep hole for it - at which point you might as well drop a rod into the bottom (like the DNOs do).


       - Andy.

  • What about the colour of the pre-wired earthing conductor being non-compliant?


    Also what about the CSA of the pre-wired earthing conductor if not suitable for a very low earth resistance?


    600mm deep is the usual stated minimum depth to avoid the impact of frost and drying out in the summer.


    The conductive polymer coating would be good for resisting depletion where DC currents are diverted to earth.

  • I am a big fan of copper earth mats. Whilst you digging a hole a 900 x 900 copper earth mat might be a cheaper and better option.


    JP
  • John Peckham:

    I am a big fan of copper earth mats. Whilst you digging a hole a 900 x 900 copper earth mat might be a cheaper and better option.


    JP


    I've to dig a couple of trenches for swa supplies to a garage and workshop. Would you suggest I lay a tape in there whilst I'm at it? Anything special about terminating the tape? (I've never seen it, let alone installed it!)


  • You might consider stacking 2 or 3 of these disks on top of each other. I have no idea how much these cost. I suspect that for general use they would not be cost efficient.. A large copper pipe buried into Marconite would be a better solution.

    Legh
  • Grumpy


    Depends on the soil conditions and what value of Ra you are trying to achieve.


    That said  a copper tape laid deep in a trench with earth rods connected to the tape as far apart as possible will should give you a very low value of Ra. I have had this done to get under 1ohm for transformer source earths.
  • I have heard of burying an old copper cylinder, might be of good contact are and if buried at depth might be quite a worthy electrode, take a bit of burying ??