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X.L.P.E.

Zoomup
Mornin' All,


Will X.L.P.E. S.W.A. cable perform reliably and safely if run through a garden pond under water permanently?


Z.
  • 0
    Probably, but it is certainly not guaranteed, so I would go for a cable designed to be submerged - and what do you mean by 'permanently'. All cables have a service life even with normal recommended installations.
  • 0
    Alasdair Anderson:

    Probably, but it is certainly not guaranteed, so I would go for a cable designed to be submerged - and what do you mean by 'permanently'. All cables have a service life even with normal recommended installations.


    Permanently = always under water.


    Z.


  • 0
    Officially, it is not intended for long term immersion, rather for 'free draining soils'

    Practically this Prysmian web note observes that medium density polythene insulation (and so XPLE) is much better than PVC in terms of the slow permeation of water, and meeting a 25 year life immersed is a reasonable expectation.

    And there are plenty of sites where the cables are in ducts that are full of water for a good fraction of the year.


    IF the pond has a liner, and the ground beneath it drains, then if it is possible then a route under the pond liner may be preferred.

    If it has to lay on the bottom of the kind of pond which gets weeded and so forth, I'd put it in some sort of flexiduct, to reduce the risk of the outer jacket getting damaged.

    Mike.


  • 0
    Zoomup:

    Permanently = always under water.

    Z.




    Sorry, I wasn't as clear as I could be. I realised you meant always under water but I meant for what life were you wanting it to survive. As Mike says, I would be perfectly happy with it for a few years but if it is planned for several decades then I would be dubious (but then, at the age I am now it would probably outlive me.....)


  • 0
    Alasdair Anderson:
    Zoomup:

    Permanently = always under water.

    Z.




    Sorry, I wasn't as clear as I could be. I realised you meant always under water but I meant for what life were you wanting it to survive. As Mike says, I would be perfectly happy with it for a few years but if it is planned for several decades then I would be dubious (but then, at the age I am now it would probably outlive me.....)




    Right, it is time for me to come clean. I posted the question in an easy to understand way because I was keen to get to work this morning and had limited time to detail things as they are. I am tasked with running an S.W.A. cable in a garden from house to shed. The ground worker, ex. Anglian Water, is keen to use ducting. I was quite happy to bury direct. I suspect that the ducting will fill with water that can not drain away, so the S.W.A. cable will suit in water forever. That was my concern. Apologies for the deception.


     I have just found this......


    SWA used underwater is out of spec I believe. Here is a reply from OMS when I asked a similar question 2 years ago:


    "Whilst it isn't generally a problem you may be interestaed in the following extracted from Appendix Q of BS 5467:


    Q.3.5

    Cables specified in this British Standard are not specifically designed for use:

    a) as self-supporting aerial cables;

    b) as submarine cable or for laying in water-logged conditions;

    c) where subsidence is likely, unless special precautions are taken to minimize damage;

    d) where any exposure to excessive heat is involved;

    e) where the oversheath is subjected to a voltage test after installation.


    Note point B.


    The problem is generally nicks etc in the sheath which allows the armouring to become saturated which eventually rusts and can force metallic particles through the bedding and insulation to the conductors as it expands.


    Ideally you would want an MDPE oversheath or a full blown submarine cable for this application.


    Of course you will mark the deviation from BS 7671 on the EIC as the installed cable is utilised outside the scope of the product standard"


    Regards

    Bruce


    Z.


  • 0
    I suspect that the ducting will fill with water that can not drain away, so the S.W.A. cable will suit in water forever.

    It shouldn't be too difficult to arrange the ducting so that it'll drain. At home I've got a few 'access points' (just a couple of inspection chamber risers with a lid on top, with a sheet of geotextile across the bottom to keep the soil out but let water seep away) - it should then be relatively easy to ensure that each length of ducting has a slight fall to an access point. In a couple of places where for aesthetic reasons the access point doesn't want to be visible, the top's just left a few 10s of cm below the surface and covered over.

       - Andy.
  • 0
    AJJewsbury:
    I suspect that the ducting will fill with water that can not drain away, so the S.W.A. cable will suit in water forever.

    It shouldn't be too difficult to arrange the ducting so that it'll drain. At home I've got a few 'access points' (just a couple of inspection chamber risers with a lid on top, with a sheet of geotextile across the bottom to keep the soil out but let water seep away) - it should then be relatively easy to ensure that each length of ducting has a slight fall to an access point. In a couple of places where for aesthetic reasons the access point doesn't want to be visible, the top's just left a few 10s of cm below the surface and covered over.

       - Andy.


    Yes Andy very sensible, but I am not in charge of laying the ducting. Mr. Ex. Anglian Water man with his digger has taken over. So the routing and details are out of my hands. He is only there to do some garden landscaping, but he has shown an interest in the running of cables, and the owner follows along.


    Z.


  • 0
    What's the difference between SWA and Wavecon?


    Having unearthed it, I can promise you that PILC lasts for decades.


    If you cannot bury SWA, a lot of us have made a big mistake.


    As a gardener, I can tell you that a spade's depth may be dry as dust in the summer, but a few inches wet and soggy in winter.


    I think that Zoomup has it right (again) - bury direct.
  • 0
    A leaky duct that fills and drains periodically means you do not need to be so fussed about sharp stones in the backfill of soft sand. If he is more of a gardener, the backfill may be soil and random stones, and no form of SWA is guaranteed for that not to compromise the jacket almost immediately, free draining soil or not.

    M.
  • 0
    mapj1:

    A leaky duct that fills and drains periodically means you do not need to be so fussed about sharp stones in the backfill of soft sand. If he is more of a gardener, the backfill may be soil and random stones, and no form of SWA is guaranteed for that not to compromise the jacket almost immediately, free draining soil or not.

    M.


    Hello Mike, the S.W.A. duct will be situated under new paving slabs. I am not sure how the duct will drain. It is a double wall type preferred by ex Anglian Water employees.


    Z.


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