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Diversity and the resilience of circuit protection.

Following a report from a well respected Contributor here, I've been tasked with sorting out a few problems in a house.

One of them is a good lesson in diversity for cooking appliances.

A 45 amp circuit breaker, 6mm T+E cable, running in some patches of insulation, so a nominal 34 amps current carrying capacity. Probably a little more, as the insulation is not continuous, and is patchy in the void the cable runs through.

This cable supplies 6 appliances. Oven 3.6kW, hob 6.2kW,frying plate 2.4kW, large microwave 2.6kW, Steamer 5.6kW and a warming drawer at 0.7kW. A total nominal rating of 94kW.

With the current diversity guidance in the OSG, this install complies (forgetting about the overloaded cable) with the hob at 10 amps, and the rest at 30% of their rating, giving a total of 32 amps but it just doesn't feel right. To get a little better control, and fault reduction, I had intended to put 2 extra new supplies in, to divide them up, I've since put one supply in, but the second one is getting rather difficult to install without taking apart the kitchen.

The oven (16amp) was on a plugtop, with no signs of overheating, or reports of problems from the householder. A 20 amp DP switch, which supplied the steamer, microwave and drawer did show a little heat damage, though that could well have been a loose connection.

So it goes back to the pragmatic view, how much can a small family cook at the same time, and there we have the diversity. They say there are 2 hob rings they never use, the fryer is rarely used etc. So the typical load is less than 3kW once the oven has warmed up.

Even with the Christmas day dinner cooking, I cannot see much more than 30 amps being pulled for a short period, hence no overheating of the cable, and no tripping of the circuit.

The circuit breakers are now 32 amps.

I heard a whisper that guidance on Diversity is changing, has anyone else heard what may be changing? 

Parents
  • It does not do that Broadgage, it has intermittent short bits see OP. As it is not damaged so far, why do you think it might become so? If it got to say 100C due to some “accident” with some of the load, what changes except the life of the cable? The point is, and I know you don't like it, the whole electrical distribution system runs like this with very little trouble. At 800A, a 600A fuse, and a piece of 0.3 sq inch cable, the cable may get quite a lot hotter than the rated temperature, and this happens under the streets every day. The 70C limiting temperature in BS7671 is based on many factors, some of them being potential cable life, the other being continuous ratings 24/7. I suggest a quick test for you to try. Get a bit of 1.5 T&E cable, put it in a 32A fuseway and put 6kW of load on the end. Set a timer. How long does it take until the cable is at 70C, and how long until you get a bad burn? I suggest you do not allow it to melt but that is at about 150C. At 130C the plasticiser may smoke a bit, and the cable becomes significantly stiffer, but nothing too horrible. This experiment is not recommended for the inexperienced as it is obviously somewhat dangerous. Beware not to touch the cable!

    The point of my comments is simple: either diversity is allowed or it is not (just in case). As long as what happens is fully understood there is no problem. The trouble that I see is that many do not understand what actually happens, and as I have said many times before, the time factor it takes to heat a cable. The dissipation per metre of domestic cables is quite low, a few watts at rated current and there is quite a thermal mass, particularly from the plastic. Strangely copper has an untypically low specific heat. As is often said of many things, time is everything.

Reply
  • It does not do that Broadgage, it has intermittent short bits see OP. As it is not damaged so far, why do you think it might become so? If it got to say 100C due to some “accident” with some of the load, what changes except the life of the cable? The point is, and I know you don't like it, the whole electrical distribution system runs like this with very little trouble. At 800A, a 600A fuse, and a piece of 0.3 sq inch cable, the cable may get quite a lot hotter than the rated temperature, and this happens under the streets every day. The 70C limiting temperature in BS7671 is based on many factors, some of them being potential cable life, the other being continuous ratings 24/7. I suggest a quick test for you to try. Get a bit of 1.5 T&E cable, put it in a 32A fuseway and put 6kW of load on the end. Set a timer. How long does it take until the cable is at 70C, and how long until you get a bad burn? I suggest you do not allow it to melt but that is at about 150C. At 130C the plasticiser may smoke a bit, and the cable becomes significantly stiffer, but nothing too horrible. This experiment is not recommended for the inexperienced as it is obviously somewhat dangerous. Beware not to touch the cable!

    The point of my comments is simple: either diversity is allowed or it is not (just in case). As long as what happens is fully understood there is no problem. The trouble that I see is that many do not understand what actually happens, and as I have said many times before, the time factor it takes to heat a cable. The dissipation per metre of domestic cables is quite low, a few watts at rated current and there is quite a thermal mass, particularly from the plastic. Strangely copper has an untypically low specific heat. As is often said of many things, time is everything.

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