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AFDDs - when do they work?

I'm struggling to see the benefots of fitting AFDD's.

I've searched the web, but cannot find any compelling evidence that they actually help in safety.

 The Proffesional Journals all say they are a good thing, but with little content to show the data used to show they make a difference.

As we know, many fires are not caused by arcs, the build up of fluff in a tumble dryer is a typical example.

When I did my Social Housing work, I found many burnt out shower switches, along with washing machine sockets and occasional cooker switches that were totally burnt around the terminals, yet, in many cases would still work until the switch finally fell apart. Clearly some of these switches had been arcing, then had fused the cable to the terminal, others showed black terminals with only a small contact area, thus heating the terminals and causing the 'fishy' smell, which was quite typical.

Is there any evidence that AFDD's would stop these failures?

What about internal appliance faults?

Wasnt Grenfell started in a fridge? If so, would AFDD detect that fault?

And, what are appliance manufacturers doing to make their goods safer? From what I see, there are still thin tin plate terminals on cookers,and poor, loose spade terminals inside firdges and other appliances.They are made to be as cheap as possible, and it shows when you tighten up a terminal, and it bends the back plate as it is so thin.   

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  • As you say hard information is sparse. My guess is that the case of the kind that  "fused the cable to the terminal" is about all they'd be able to detect that other devices (e.g. RCDs) wouldn't have anyway.  If money were no object I'd probably have them on the basis that in the game of natural selection every little helps, but in the real world I'd probably think that spending that money on about 101 other things first would probably yield better results. (Personally I'd go for BS 8436 cables, either metal or thermosetting plastic enclosures for accessories, and better terminals - as being a more thorough approach to a wider range of problems.) 

    The rather radical change of emphasis in their use BS 7671 between AMD1 (generally in fire vulnerable environments (sleeping accommodation, combustible materials) and AMD2 (just socket outlet circuits in high-rise and high density housing) it does seem to suggest that their emphasis is now more on portable appliances rather than fixed wiring. Not many portable appliances draw more than 2.5A (so unlikely to help with the knock-off hovverboard or electronic cigarette chargers that seem prone to starting fires), the likes of irons and vacuum cleaners are tend to be attended when in use, so likely to be unplugged if they start misbehaving, long before they'd get to the stage of starting a fire. I guess portable room heaters are the most likely candidate, but how often they suffer arc faults rather than just just falling over and overheating the fluff, I'd have my doubts.

    I suppose my slight hope in all this is that if we start introducing devices that can very carefully monitor the details of load currents and use some decent intelligence in evaluating them, there might be the possibility of detecting other problems. E.g. the increase in resistance over time of a loose connection or overloaded conductor is likely to be quite different to that of a normal load (comparable with the arcing from motor bushes being distinguishable from arcing from a loose wire) so perhaps the basics of an AFDD could in time be adapted to something that is more generally useful.

       - Andy.

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  • As you say hard information is sparse. My guess is that the case of the kind that  "fused the cable to the terminal" is about all they'd be able to detect that other devices (e.g. RCDs) wouldn't have anyway.  If money were no object I'd probably have them on the basis that in the game of natural selection every little helps, but in the real world I'd probably think that spending that money on about 101 other things first would probably yield better results. (Personally I'd go for BS 8436 cables, either metal or thermosetting plastic enclosures for accessories, and better terminals - as being a more thorough approach to a wider range of problems.) 

    The rather radical change of emphasis in their use BS 7671 between AMD1 (generally in fire vulnerable environments (sleeping accommodation, combustible materials) and AMD2 (just socket outlet circuits in high-rise and high density housing) it does seem to suggest that their emphasis is now more on portable appliances rather than fixed wiring. Not many portable appliances draw more than 2.5A (so unlikely to help with the knock-off hovverboard or electronic cigarette chargers that seem prone to starting fires), the likes of irons and vacuum cleaners are tend to be attended when in use, so likely to be unplugged if they start misbehaving, long before they'd get to the stage of starting a fire. I guess portable room heaters are the most likely candidate, but how often they suffer arc faults rather than just just falling over and overheating the fluff, I'd have my doubts.

    I suppose my slight hope in all this is that if we start introducing devices that can very carefully monitor the details of load currents and use some decent intelligence in evaluating them, there might be the possibility of detecting other problems. E.g. the increase in resistance over time of a loose connection or overloaded conductor is likely to be quite different to that of a normal load (comparable with the arcing from motor bushes being distinguishable from arcing from a loose wire) so perhaps the basics of an AFDD could in time be adapted to something that is more generally useful.

       - Andy.

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