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Car Park Movement switching or sensor options

I have two basement car parks, one above the other, with existing 5' LED vapor proof fittings throughout.

These lighting circuits are currently on a timeclock (So all circuits have a switched supply back to a set of contactors - which is useful - this timeclock, however has been left on for the last 15 years or so, so that these lights are permanently on as this is a 24/7 commercial office building)

These have all recently been changed from florries to LED. These lights run in suspended 2" lighting trunking from a concrete roof, with the lid on the underside of the trunking and the light fittings hold the lid in place, so to access the trunking, the fitting needs to be removed.

There are 3 rows of lights running down the length of a long, narrow,  L shaped car park, circa 100m long in total length the center row has the emergency lights on it.

Now with some additional energy saving ideas in mind, the client would like to keep the center row on permanently, but switch the outer two rows of lights.

- I could change every light for lights with an integral PIR in them - this is too expensive and what a waste of a recent change over to LED.

- do you get retro fit PIRS that can be fitted into the light fittings? You must be able to. Can anyone recommend or post a link for this?

- I could add surface mount 360 degree PIRs controlling 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 lights at time, (There'll be limitations on each PIRs ability to switch the LED load) being careful of course to not mix up circuits or neutrals between circuits, but this will likely mean removal and re-ensatement of quite a few fittings. This is probably going to be my best cheap option.

- In seeking other ideas:

Microwave sensors are an option - two control circuits run to micro wave sensors - covering each length of the L shape. I'm concerned about the micro wave sensitivity though as, in this car park, there is a lot of air movement from the main air handling units and silly things like spider webs. Micro wave sensors might be too sensitive. 

- Do they do PIR beam detectors? Can anyone recommend a company that might do this. All the doors into and out of the car park are in one part of the L shape, so that may be the only part of the car park that needs detection. 

- how do most car parks handle this? 

- My favorite solution, had I all the money in the world, would be something like the lighting we have been installing on the railway platforms, (Column lights) that dim when no one is around, and get brighter when movement is detected. We're certainly not getting the idoor version of those though...........too expensive. 

Parents
  • How safe is this against vandals, and generally how are the environmental conditions, ? Electronic sensors vary in their IP rating.

    As noted 'mostly off' can be the default state, perhaps enough to maintain an emergancy exit level but it does mean some extra cores in the wiring, so that cost needs to be offset against the saving.

    Some hard sums about what it costs to run need to be done first and how much labour that will pay for.

    Depending how the LED fittings are made it may or may not be possible to add a sensor into each lamp but it is not the way I would, as it makes it hard for someone following  to maintain also - you do not want really the consumption of too many  of sensors at 5W each, to switch  LEDs at 20W each.

    The central contactor or one per large zone is a nice idea, and coupled with a timer of perhaps 15 mins and a number of sensors  in key places that trigger it .

    Mike.

Reply
  • How safe is this against vandals, and generally how are the environmental conditions, ? Electronic sensors vary in their IP rating.

    As noted 'mostly off' can be the default state, perhaps enough to maintain an emergancy exit level but it does mean some extra cores in the wiring, so that cost needs to be offset against the saving.

    Some hard sums about what it costs to run need to be done first and how much labour that will pay for.

    Depending how the LED fittings are made it may or may not be possible to add a sensor into each lamp but it is not the way I would, as it makes it hard for someone following  to maintain also - you do not want really the consumption of too many  of sensors at 5W each, to switch  LEDs at 20W each.

    The central contactor or one per large zone is a nice idea, and coupled with a timer of perhaps 15 mins and a number of sensors  in key places that trigger it .

    Mike.

Children
  • Why 15 minutes Mike, it is only 100m in size or so? If access is unlimited then every entry is potentially a problem and CCTV of the entrances is the answer, not more power consumption on the lighting. And 5W per PIR is ridiculous. This needs a proper Engineering answer not a "What if" kind of view, it is just too expensive.

  • To allow folk to get to their cars, put their bags in, start the car, manouvre round other cars and drive out without sudden change in light level causing an accident.  And to avoid excessive switching at peak times.

    M.

    How  much current do you think a PIR sensor draws ? On and off states both need to be considered It will be less in the off state.

  • Do we need to address switching times to reduce switching operation numbers? Are LEDs along with filament lamps and fluorescent lamps  life expectancy de-rated by numerous energising/de-energising cycles?

  • They shouldn't be affected. There is no known mechanism provided that the power supply can cope and not overload the LEDs during switching. LEDs running on Unsmoothed rectified mains for example are switched on and off at 50Hz.

  • Thanks for that clarification David