Hi Chris, I’m sorry to hear that you had to go through such a frightening experience. Fibrillation is a serious condition that can affect the heart’s ability to pump blood effectively. I’m glad that you were able to receive the treatment you needed and that you are doing well now.

AMK, thank you. Atrial fibrillation, which I had is more of a nuisance than anything else; ventricular fibrillation (which can occur after an electric shock) is fatal if not treated within a few minutes. That's why defibrillators are carried in ambulances, etc.

My experience was not at all frightening because it was used for the former. The irritating bit was that the cardiologist insisted on sedation so I was not conscious at the time and experienced nothing.

According to the commentary on BS 7671 book, the timing of the shock in relation to the cardiac cycle is a critical factor for the outcome. For example, if the shock coincides with a certain point, it can induce ventricular fibrillation, which as you described is a condition where the ventricles of the heart tremble instead of contracting blood. This is a life-threatening situation that requires urgent defibrillation. However, was it a shock that caused your atrial fibrillation ?  (atria of the heart beat irregularly). So this is what You experienced ? and did you undergo a procedure called cardioversion to correct it ? (low-energy electric shock that is synchronized with the heart’s natural rhythm) but has anyone ever experienced an electric shock? How did it affect you? What did you do about it?

The Defibrilators carried by ambulances are actually quite clever - first they look for the electrical signal for a pulse and will not fire unless there really is a patient connected and a irregular rythm is detected that needs correction,

Then a large capacitor is charged, much in the manner of a camera flash gun, and discharged into the patient. The intention here  is to bring all the muscles to a dead stop, so it restarts with the correct timing.

The public ones are even better, and a 'Dalek voice'  will talk a complete novice through the procedure so no real skill other than English and staying calm is needed.

Having looked into this for a previous project, and being taught  1st aid both for work and for Scouts, the energies discharged are eye watering and far above what we would consider safe for things like electric fences etc.

Soberingly, despite what occurs on films etc,  even with a defib machine,  success is far from  guaranteed  (50-70% from a heart attack in the street) but it is much higher than CPR alone ( which sadly has less than 10% survival rate).

Chris's process sounds a lot more safe and controlled, but according to the NHS at least artrial fibrillation is generally not life threatening, many people live more or less normal lives with this condition for some time before recognition  and treatment.

Mike

AS GK has said 710 can be applied to veterinary practices. However it would be a good idea to ask the head vet and/or business owner if they want 710 to be applied to there premises. A good idea would be to show them 710 in your BBB and explain it to them and ask if they want these additional provisions and get their response in writing just in case the absence of 710 provisions was called in to doubt.

It could be they are treating very valuable and/or rare animals that may impact on their decision and also their insurance company may have a view on liability.

As for CPR I have done it 3 times with one success but years later I still think about my 2 unsuccessful attempts and question myself if I could have done better. One of those events I revisit when wide awake in the night where I am back at the scene replaying every precise event in graphic detail. 

JP

As for CPR I have done it 3 times with one success but years later I still think about my 2 unsuccessful attempts and question myself if I could have done better

My first first-aid course was very good on that point - it was run an ex-paramedic and he illustrated many of the point with an account of an incident or two from the ambulances - a large number were suffixed with "that one didn't make it either". We were all left with the definite impression that it's all very far from an exact science and most of the variables are set even before you arrive - so even the professionals can't save everyone - far from it. It was pretty much drummed into us that you do your best, but you may well only make a significant difference to someone in maybe 1 out of 100 cases - but just that one case makes all the effort more than worthwhile.

   - Andy.

John Peckham said:

As for CPR I have done it 3 times with one success but years later I still think about my 2 unsuccessful attempts and question myself if I could have done better. One of those events I revisit when wide awake in the night where I am back at the scene replaying every precise event in graphic detail.

A bit of thread drift going on here!

The out of hospital success rate is less than 10% (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(18)30552-X/fulltext#:~:text=Out%2Dof%2Dhospital%20cardiac%20arrest%20(OHCA)%20describes%20the,of%20a%20good%20outcome%20decreases.) so 1:3 is good.

However, I know exactly what JP means. I shall never forget the poor boy who died in a relatively minor RTC on the A3 south of Guildford 25 years ago. If the RTC didn't kill him directly, the well-intentioned but incompetent folk who extracted him from the vehicle when there was no need to so so may have done. I was a cou-le of minutes too late.

AMK said:

has anyone ever experienced an electric shock? How did it affect you? What did you do about it?

Slightly closer to the original thread ...

My first was at the age of about 8. We had lamps attached to the bed head and they were operated by a switch on a dangling bit of flex. Mine fell off in the night so when I reached up in the morning I touched a live cable. I have never before or since least out of bed so quickly.

My most recent time was when re-wiring daughter's house. I could not isolate the whole installation because she and other tradesmen wanted power, but I had isolated the downstairs lights and proved dead. Problem was that one of the light switched was connected to a different circuit. I swore!

(The place was a potential death trap - one ordinary sized room had sockets powered by three different circuits.)

Apart from the obvious learning point about proving dead all the time, I think that the experiences were merely unpleasant because I was somewhat insulated from the general mass of the earth and I was able to let go.

I experienced my first electric shock when I was a 17-year-old apprentice. I was assigned to replace a socket in a pub kitchen. I verified that the socket was not live and proceeded to disconnect it. I had both ends of the ring line conductor in my hands, when suddenly I felt a jolt of pain. I heard a loud scream and wondered who was making such a racket, only to realize that it was me. The electrician I was working with had turned the circuit back on without warning me! It was a shocking experience, literally and figuratively. 

but has anyone ever experienced an electric shock?

Oh yes - quite a number of times (mostly as the result of a mis-spent youth in the days before elves & safety).

Earliest I recall I must have been about 6 - I'd noticed that the 2-bar electric fire in the front room seemed to take a long time after switching for the elements to start glowing. I wondered if they were getting hot before they glowed. To try and answer my own question I decided to try to put my hand on one of the element to feel how hot it was, but realizing that if it was very hot I could get burned, I decided to put my hand on the element when it was definitely cold and then switch on with my other hand - my reasoning being that I'd then have time to pull my hand back through the guard as soon it started to get warm, before it got too hot. However my safety precautions didn't include an understanding of electricity at that time - but I learned very quickly that: a) electricity hurt (a lot), and b) it pulls (so not so easy to get your hand back).

A bit later there was the experiment with my Grandmothers 2-pin plugs you could get at the live parts just by spinning the lid off...

Then a few experiments in my teens (mainly trying to switch mains via triacs) which wouldn't have held water in a modern risk assessment...

In adult life I seem to have been relatively safe ... until I was asked to replace a shower pull switch (odd sort of rental place - lots of office style suspended ceilings) - isolated the shower circuit, proved dead, got a belt when I touched the c.p.c.  Double checked the c.p.c. - definitely at 0V - turned out the metal ceiling grid was live from a combination of a fault in another room, break in a lighting circuit c.p.c. and class 1 fittings attached to the grid. Sometimes you just can't win.

    - Andy.