BS7671 - It's A School Day (Every day is a school day)

Something to ponder for a Friday


Should the period of inspect for schools fixed electrical systems be shortened from 5 years to 3 or even made annual?

Should schools for under 16 years be granted special location status in BS7671?

Should all circuits in schools be protected by a 30mA RCBO/RCD regardless of their use?  This would apply to new or existing circuits.

Should schools have an accessible earth rod/disc and an inspection pit?


As always please be polite and respectful in this purely academic debate. 



Come on everybody lets help inspire the future.

Parents
  • My perspective on this comes from having (in the past):

    • Overall responsibility for the electrical safety of a school in my role as Health and Safety Governor (it's surprising how much Governors are responsible for!)
    • Overall responsibility for the electrical safety of an engineering office and, to some extent, a factory in my role as engineering manager / deputy site director
    • Overall responsibility for the electrical safety of my house (and I'm still stuck with that one!)

    Of the three the school was by far the easiest, and I would say lowest risk. This was because, in my experience at least:

    • Schools are very risk averse environments. This leads on to several of the following points.
    • Schools contract all electrical work to approved contractors. A school would not dream of doing anything to their own electrical system. Now, it is possible that now that most schools are out of local authority control that they will tend to go for the lowest cost option, but even then they are going to look for some level of competence / registration / insurance etc.
    • Schools design themselves to prevent risk. There will be some areas of electrical risk, typically kitchens and (for those that still have them, very sadly many don't) workshops, but these will be risk assessed to the hilt and segregated off. As a really simple example, it'll be surprising if you see an electric kettle in a normal classroom.
    • School staff are terrified of children getting hurt, which tends to mean that problems such as faulty wiring / sockets etc tend to get reported very quickly. Not always (and see below), but in my experience I'd say more often than in other environments.

    Best summing up for me of how risk averse schools with regards to electricity are was the time I was going in to run a STEM activity at one I hadn't been to before, and when I said I was going to bring in my WorkMate was told that I'd have to get it PAT tested...

    I'm not saying it's all a bed of roses, there are a few issues I tended to see (fortunately more in other schools I went into than in the one I was responsible for):

    • Risk of physical damage to fittings, using basically domestic fittings in an environment where occasionally wild things happen.
    • Poor administration meaning that issues didn't get followed up.
    • Lack of budget meaning that issues didn't get followed up.
    • And the bugbear of anyone responsible for schools (but the same for offices and factories) - stopping staff sneaking electrical appliances in!!! 

    So of course it's a good thought to raise, but overall personally I'd say my children were at much lower risk regarding electrical safety when they were at school than when they were at home or at friend's houses. And I don't remember ever seeing an issue which needed a change in the technical standards to resolve it. The challenge there always was, and unfortunately I suspect has only got worse, is effective administration and sufficient budget to manage and resolve issues when they arise. There are already legal obligations to require that electrical issues are managed, but practically ensuring that they are is another issue. A world which I'm very glad I'm out of now.

    I guess one question that could be asked regarding the point about is there more we can do (i.e. is it ALARP) is again more on the admin than the technical side, whether now that many (maybe the majority?) of schools are out of local authority control there should be a periodic level of risk management oversight (not just of electrical issues, but of all risk management)? Maybe Ofsted do it now, I'm not sure. Not that, personally, when we were under local authority control the LA H&S reviewer was of much help whatsoever (I'm being very, very polite there)... 

    I'm actually giving a STEM talk next week in the school where I used to be a governor, I think it's the first time I've been in there for about 10 years or maybe more...but I'm not taking any mains powered equipment, and I've done a very full risk assessment (whether they want one or not Slight smile )

    Thanks,

    Andy

Reply
  • My perspective on this comes from having (in the past):

    • Overall responsibility for the electrical safety of a school in my role as Health and Safety Governor (it's surprising how much Governors are responsible for!)
    • Overall responsibility for the electrical safety of an engineering office and, to some extent, a factory in my role as engineering manager / deputy site director
    • Overall responsibility for the electrical safety of my house (and I'm still stuck with that one!)

    Of the three the school was by far the easiest, and I would say lowest risk. This was because, in my experience at least:

    • Schools are very risk averse environments. This leads on to several of the following points.
    • Schools contract all electrical work to approved contractors. A school would not dream of doing anything to their own electrical system. Now, it is possible that now that most schools are out of local authority control that they will tend to go for the lowest cost option, but even then they are going to look for some level of competence / registration / insurance etc.
    • Schools design themselves to prevent risk. There will be some areas of electrical risk, typically kitchens and (for those that still have them, very sadly many don't) workshops, but these will be risk assessed to the hilt and segregated off. As a really simple example, it'll be surprising if you see an electric kettle in a normal classroom.
    • School staff are terrified of children getting hurt, which tends to mean that problems such as faulty wiring / sockets etc tend to get reported very quickly. Not always (and see below), but in my experience I'd say more often than in other environments.

    Best summing up for me of how risk averse schools with regards to electricity are was the time I was going in to run a STEM activity at one I hadn't been to before, and when I said I was going to bring in my WorkMate was told that I'd have to get it PAT tested...

    I'm not saying it's all a bed of roses, there are a few issues I tended to see (fortunately more in other schools I went into than in the one I was responsible for):

    • Risk of physical damage to fittings, using basically domestic fittings in an environment where occasionally wild things happen.
    • Poor administration meaning that issues didn't get followed up.
    • Lack of budget meaning that issues didn't get followed up.
    • And the bugbear of anyone responsible for schools (but the same for offices and factories) - stopping staff sneaking electrical appliances in!!! 

    So of course it's a good thought to raise, but overall personally I'd say my children were at much lower risk regarding electrical safety when they were at school than when they were at home or at friend's houses. And I don't remember ever seeing an issue which needed a change in the technical standards to resolve it. The challenge there always was, and unfortunately I suspect has only got worse, is effective administration and sufficient budget to manage and resolve issues when they arise. There are already legal obligations to require that electrical issues are managed, but practically ensuring that they are is another issue. A world which I'm very glad I'm out of now.

    I guess one question that could be asked regarding the point about is there more we can do (i.e. is it ALARP) is again more on the admin than the technical side, whether now that many (maybe the majority?) of schools are out of local authority control there should be a periodic level of risk management oversight (not just of electrical issues, but of all risk management)? Maybe Ofsted do it now, I'm not sure. Not that, personally, when we were under local authority control the LA H&S reviewer was of much help whatsoever (I'm being very, very polite there)... 

    I'm actually giving a STEM talk next week in the school where I used to be a governor, I think it's the first time I've been in there for about 10 years or maybe more...but I'm not taking any mains powered equipment, and I've done a very full risk assessment (whether they want one or not Slight smile )

    Thanks,

    Andy

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