Is it time the regulations change and state that LSZH (Low Smoke Zero Halogen)cable be used in ALL domestic dwelling installs/retospective installs/repairs and alterations?

Remember LSF (Low Smoke Fume) is not the same as LSZH

BS 7671 is a minimum standard for electrical installtions, a floor not a ceiling. The designer of the installtion, and all installtions temporary and permanent have to be designed,  the designer can and should make additional provisions based on their engineering judgement. I design electrical installtions and I always specify LSZH cables because I know that oridnary PVC cables generate toxic vapours and gases includuding hydrochloric acid when heated. 

XLPE cables also don't char in the same, with the consequetial breakdown of cable insulation,  way as PVC cables so you have to ask why we need AFDDs on circuits supplying sockets in some builings and recomended in all buildings? I would be interested in your views?

JP

John Peckham said:

so you have to ask why we need AFDDs on circuits supplying sockets in some builings and recomended in all buildings? I would be interested in your views?

Not sure where you are hoping this might go JP, but you asked for views, so here goes;

I am someone who has an abiding interest in fire safety. It is part of what I have done almost every day of my working life for 30 years. I have studied fire events that were deemed to have been caused by an ignition source in the fixed electrical installation, right across the board from the Rosepark Care Home to a fire that gutted our own parliament building (Stormont) in 1995. 
Whilst I would not dismiss the merits of AFDDs out of hand, they would be right at the bottom of my list of suggested control measures. If one had to pare things from a limited budget, they would be first to go.

So I am, at best, a sceptic. I can see no significant body of evidence that would lead me to be persuaded otherwise. Interestingly, with respect to the requirements of AFDDs in BS7671, I have witnessed how easy it is to persuade fire risk assessors and other fire safety professionals who have no electrical background to jump on a compliance bandwagon without really understanding the technical nuances. 

I suppose views on the subject will inevitably be wildly different. Even the electrical standards emanating from a specific source cannot agree. Compare this from the 2024 amendment to IS10101-2020 to the requirements of 7671. Small wonder it leaves many scratching their heads!

edit to pare pair! Thank you MapJ1!

John Peckham said:

so you have to ask why we need AFDDs on circuits supplying sockets in some builings and recomended in all buildings? I would be interested in your views?

Not sure where you are hoping this might go JP, but you asked for views, so here goes;

I am someone who has an abiding interest in fire safety. It is part of what I have done almost every day of my working life for 30 years. I have studied fire events that were deemed to have been caused by an ignition source in the fixed electrical installation, right across the board from the Rosepark Care Home to a fire that gutted our own parliament building (Stormont) in 1995. 
Whilst I would not dismiss the merits of AFDDs out of hand, they would be right at the bottom of my list of suggested control measures. If one had to pare things from a limited budget, they would be first to go.

So I am, at best, a sceptic. I can see no significant body of evidence that would lead me to be persuaded otherwise. Interestingly, with respect to the requirements of AFDDs in BS7671, I have witnessed how easy it is to persuade fire risk assessors and other fire safety professionals who have no electrical background to jump on a compliance bandwagon without really understanding the technical nuances. 

I suppose views on the subject will inevitably be wildly different. Even the electrical standards emanating from a specific source cannot agree. Compare this from the 2024 amendment to IS10101-2020 to the requirements of 7671. Small wonder it leaves many scratching their heads!

edit to pare pair! Thank you MapJ1!

That is an interesting excerpt, and while much broader in catchment - even a caravan has sleeping accommodation after all-  feels much more accepting that there may be other ways to mitigate the risk, that are not 'install an AFDD willy nilly' without mandating what they are. Some old school solutions like metal conduit and pyro wire come to mind but I am sure that careful placement (and selection) of wiring and accessories cover a lot of it and things like not leaving huge voids for fire to spread unseen are far more significant in lives saved per pound spent.

I think "right at the bottom of my list of suggested control measures. If one had to pare things from a limited budget, they would be first to go." is probably about right.

Mike