16A sockets in domestic installation

I'm intending to use a small CNC at home. It needs a 16A single phase supply and preferably I'd just connect via an interlocked EN 60309 commando socket, but that would be a departure from 553.1.201 because commando sockets aren't shuttered.

Ironically I would be okay installing a European Schuko on a 16A radial - because they are shuttered but clearly not particularly robust for a workshop and not polarised either. Maybe get an IEC 60906-1 from South Africa.

Of course I can risk assess a departure from 553.1.201 given that interlocking offers a greater level of safety than shutters. 

I could use a 15A BS 546 but these days protective devices are harmonised at 6, 10, 16A etc. And BS 546 / BS 1363 haven't kept up, so a 15A wouldn't have sufficient protection and in any case i think an interlocked commando offers a greater level of protection.

I presume many electicians just put commandos in people's garages without even considering that they're departing from BS 7671.

I get the impression 553.1.201 is a old provision which when read today has unintended consequences. It is of course a national departure from HD 60664.

What are people's thoughts on using commando sockets in a dwelling? In terms of the departure risk assessment, are there circumstances in which an interlocked socket may offer less safety than a shuttered socket? 

  • To me, a CNC machine does not fall within the scope of 'household and similar use', therefore 553.1.201 does not apply. Using an interlocked industrial socket will provide comparable protection to shuttering.
    They should be used for specific purposes, which in this case is the CNC machine but could similarly be for any other piece of workshop equipment.

    Use the interlock version, RCD the circuit, crack on.

  • Apparently a small workshop in a shed or garage is not typical of 'domestic use' even if it is part of a household. (at the risk of a H and S failure, in my household I beg to differ. *)


    Equally the other way one might stretch the household and similar to include domestic type equipment used in a domestic way but in a work setting - a hotel or a small office you would expect the vacuum cleaner and kettle to be used with 13A shuttered sockets, but really not the 3 phase industrial oven in the hotel kitchen.

    In a case like that,  if you really had to, you could probably make a case for not being too worried about the shutters or the interlocks either if access was restricted to folk who know what they are doing.

    After all the free ends of commando cables with un-shuttered sockets get draped around on caravan and camp sites and festivals and so on,  by folk I'd consider to be at best to be 'instructed' but not always that 'skilled' and that's a comparable, perhaps greater, level of risk given water and vehicles.

    Interlocking and shuttering achieve a similar end - exposed metal is dead, live metal is not exposed. Its a pretty solid argument.


    Mike.

    * At my place I've got a few 16 amp ones on a 20A circuit for the lathe, welder and similar abnormal household appliances so perhaps I'm biased. Just don't put them on a 32A breaker with the 13A sockets.

  • I agree with pww235.

    At some stage, machinery gets too big for "household" use. One might even say that is when a BS 1362 fuse is not man enough to withstand the start-up current.

  • Good point.

    In some places BS 7671 uses the term "household and similar use" in others we see e.g.  at 411.3.4 [additional protection on luminaries] that it refers to domestic premises.

    So for example the lighting circuit to a home workshop must protected by a 30mA RCD because it's in a dwelling. But a socket outlet in the workshop would have under the blue book wording of 411.3.3 have also have needed additional protection because it's physically in a dwelling, in the brown books wording of 411.3.3 I can omit it subject to risk assessment given it's not a space for the use of persons of capability BA1&2.

    So I think there's a lot of weight in your comment here. 

    One place I do often see 16A commandos in a domestic is caravan owners where they certainly are BA1&2. So I don't think that would enjoy a non-household application exemption. But I do think a departure from 553.1.201 should be reasonable if the socket is interlocked.

  • In regards BS 1362 my personal view is that since the widespread adoption of RCD protection, i really wouldn't be surprised if BS 1362 fuses are responsible for starting more fires than they've prevented.

    Imo BS 1363-1 should be re-rated to 10A as that is the continuous rating. The fuse is often the source of thermal damage when laypersons overload a 4 way extension lead. Modern designs of fuses with similar ratings are typically much larger - such as Midget fuses which therefore don't get anywhere near as hot.

    If BS 1363-1 sockets were rated 10A and protected as such then maybe that would save lives? 3kW kettles wouldn't be affected because they're only for intermittent use.

  • Oh 13A fused plugs can start fires all right....
    A commando socket to supply this 2.5kW heated food cabinet would have been much safer even without shutters. Gloved hands in photo for scale only - its all been isolated.



     Mike

  • Ah, but 3kW fan heaters are still in use these days (e.g. https://groceries.asda.com/product/fans-heaters/eurosonic-3-kw-white-flat-fan-heater/1000145922738 ) As I understand it, 13A was chosen over 10A in the original discussions, because 3kW room heaters were considered necessary here 'up north'.

      -  Andy.

  • That 3kW fan heater looks like exactly the kind of thing which derating BS 1363 to 10A and therefore making it obsolete would represent a significant improvement in safety.

    Being acceptable in 1947 is not the strongest argument for retaining a rating.

  • That's a bit sweeping.  If we made BS1363 obsolete, there would be serious ramifications. In my opinion if anything a lightening up on the plug and socket regs to include the use of higher rated sockets like commandos, to encourage their use on loads requiring 10A and up, whether domestic or not,  would be more to the point.
    Mike

  • Sorry I meant making 3kW domestic portable appliances obsolete, not BS 1363-1 which I think should just be derated to 10A with a 13A easement for intermittent use I.e. kettles.

    This would have little practical effect except for on multi way extension leads and a few appliances that probably don't comply with their respective appliance standards anyway.