Chartership through further learning at work, HND to IEng & CEng?

Question

Hello all! Bit of a wild card here.. I appreciate any one reading & commenting! I have kept certain institutions anonymous as I just want to shed light to my query. I had interrupted my studies at a Russel Group university on a CIBSE & Part 1 RIBA accredited course due to carer responsibilities. 2 years on, I'm resuming my career and progression to IEng & CEng. I reached out to my personal tutor also the Head of "X course" to re-join & was told that I will most likely not allowed back due to the development in the industry/course material, the university's T&Cs on maximum period of completion & would have to re-enrol entirely. My physical transcripts are on hold due to administrative issues during my interruption. Currently holding a HND/Level 5, I'm struggling to find any entry level work (relevant to IEng) let alone company training schemes/sponsorships without a Bachelors degree (& transcripts). Is this because the criteria to meet IEng is only through a Bachelors (in a relevant degree & accredited institution) after Sept 1999? Or is it because I do not hold a BEng/Level 6? If so I'm not able to be accepted onto an accredited and relevant top up course due to my transcripts (I tried & was told by the admissions team to send a letter from my head of faculty confirming my attendance. To be then ignored by the admissions officer after relaying what I was told would suffice). Is it right to not wait x months/years till the next academic enrolment (or the mercy of an empathetic admissions officer) and to instead progress through relevant work experience & sponsorship? 
 Entry roles of interest (usually BEng level): Building Physics Engineer, Sustainability consultant, Structural Engineer, Project Design Engineer, Building Services Engineer, Environmental Engineer. Roles I am a top candidate for (HND level): CAD Technician, usually for data centres which is not relevant in the further learning at work route to IEng? 
 I'm very stuck with my options at the moment as this was not part of my Net Zero initiative 10 year plan! 
 I would appreciate any insight into my career progression with a HND to Chartership! 
 To confirm my questions are: 1) Is there a route to Chartership by a Licensed Professional Engineering Institution for engineers in the UK with a HND, 
 2) How do I find a sponsor to get on the IEng ladder with a HND? 
 3) Can I apply to EngTech with a HND? 
 
 My sources; From the Engineering council, www.engc.org.uk/.../incorporated-engineer-ieng 
 
 An HNC or HND started after Sept 1999 (but before Sept 2010 in the case of the HNC) or a Foundation Degree in engineering or technology, plus appropriate further learning to degree level 
 
 It then goes onto "Please note: 
 
 You can still become an IEng without these academic qualifications. Further information about the individual, work-based, assessment process can be found in UK-SPEC and from your Licensed PEI " 
 
 My Licensed PEI: CIBSE https://www.cibse.org/media/5izkxlj2/acibse-application-guidance-2021.pdf CIBR19123 Associate Application Guidance v2 
 "If you do not hold an exemplifying qualification for IEng, you can take the experience route as depicted below." 
 "Find a sponsor who can support your application." 
 
 From my university: 
 Absolute maximum period for completion &ndash; Full-time

Honours Degree 
 6 years

"The school will then need to judge whether, in the light of these circumstances, it is possible for the student to complete their studies within a period that sufficiently ensures the currency of their knowledge, their competency and the quality of their degree. If the school believes that it is, on balance, appropriate to extend the absolute maximum for that student, they will then provide a new absolute maximum to which the student must adhere."

Mark Tickner · Accepted Answer

Hi Grace, 
 1) Technically yes, and I have supported a person who had an HND and did manage to get their CEng. However, essentially you are replacing the educational aspects with further learning through work based learning. This experience has to be at the right level, which doesn't sound like its the case for you right now. 
 3) Yes, I've seen cases of people who have BSc's/BEng's apply for EngTech. So an HND should't be an issue as long as you can demonstrate the competencies. 
 2) This is challenging - especially in the current market... 
 Clutching at straws a bit, but one route would be to see if there are any apprenticeships available, especially with companies working of large government funded projects that have a social commitment to meet. However, that can be a bit of a postcode lottery. The new funding rules can impact you if you fall outside the age limit. 
 One thing to consider is organisations like Supported Return to Work Programmes | STEM Returners . There are a few other similar organisations like this. I did meet someone on this scheme, but she didn't ultimately take up a job after her placement.

Mark Tickner · Answer

Hi Grace, 
 I can't share too many details. But I volunteer as a professional registration advisor with a different institution, and the person was allocated to me when they applied for a mentor. They got me in part because I'm experienced with that institutions procedure for further learning. 
 At that time they had ~6years post the L5 apprenticeship that led to the HND and were in a technical manager type role, leading a small team. So, demonstrating the competencies was fairly easy, it was just the task to demonstrate that they had the equivalent education. As it was an apprenticeship, they also had work experience through the HND as well. 
 To sort of answer the second part of your question, it was mostly done through relevant work experience. They hadn't done any top up certificates.

Philip Oakley · Answer

The Engineering council does not require any formal academic qualification for any registration category. But, it does require suitable underpinning knowledge and understanding (UKU) and broadly sets out equivalences for those who gain such base knowledge through an academic qualification. 
 In general the institutions and academia like it that way as they can play an "each to their own" with a little bit of quality assurance thrown in. Most then have side routes that look at existing UKU but this requires you to 'present' your case with demonstrations that you know your stuff. 
 See Paul Meenan of the 'e5 group' story for inspiration . 
 
 Are you doing the courses just to get the certificate (i.e. already know the stuff)? Or is it a conscious effort to build a broader/deeper understanding around what you already know? 
 You could try other colleges/universities to see if you can transfer some prior learning, or even go back to the admissions part of your former establishment (as a professional, a second opinion is valuable..)

Mark Tickner · Answer

Grace Kahil said: It seems to be a closed system even though an individual doesn't require a degree for chartership. 
 That's a fair point. The Engineering Council essentially defines that you need the equivalent of an accredited masters for CEng. But what makes an equivalence is a hard question. I suspect in part its due to the complexity of the assessment. 
 If you have no qualifications at all, many institutions seem to go the path of having the candidate write a technical report (essentially a masters level project write-up). But you are in the position where you have a reasonable level of qualification. In fact the Engineering Council AHEP standard does define what the top-up from a HND should look like for IEng. 
 One of our graduates (who has a bachelors) asked me recently whether it was better to go for a part time MSc (typically 3 years) or to just build experience. Ultimately, its not going to be a dissimilar time to build the experience, so my view was it depended if they wanted to do the MSc. 
 Incidentally, in my field there is the CSEP certification, if you don't have an appropriate degree, they define the requirements as: 
 &bull; Have five (5) years systems engineering experience with a qualifying degree. If lacking a qualifying degree, the following is required: o With a non-qualifying bachelor&rsquo;s degree or no degree: 10 years of engineering experience is required, of which a minimum of 5 years must be SE experience 
 So, any person lacking the appropriate qualifications needs an extra 5 years of engineering experience. At least its well defined!

Gerard · Answer

The engineering council does not require any equivalent to a masters for CEng. A recognised MEng or recognised batchelors with recognised masters can be used to demonstrate UK&u but there is the IET individual route too. Over 70% of applicants to the IET adopt this non recognised route. The requirement, as copied from V4 UKSPEC is:

Chartership through further learning at work, HND to IEng & CEng?

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