Rules and Guidelines
Want to participate in the discussions? Please read our Community Rules and Guidelines. Need some help? Visit Support and Answers.

  • State Not Answered
  • Locked Locked
  • Replies 27 replies
  • Subscribers 10 subscribers
  • Views 1411 views
  • Users 0 members are here
Options
You may also be interested in
This discussion is locked.
You cannot post a reply to this discussion. If you have a question start a new discussion

Incorporated Engineer (IEng) UK vs Engineering Technologist (ET) Pakistan

Nouman Abid Chuhan
Hi / Assalam u Alaikum


I am registered with the EC as Incorporated Engineer (IEng) through the IET UK.  Now i am very pleased to inform all of you that i am also registered with the National Technology Council (NTC) www.ntc-hec.org.pk Pakistan as Professional Engineering Technologist (PE.Tech).


Four Years B.Tech-Hons or BS Tech or BSc Engineering Technology Degrees (attested by the Higher Education Commission - HEC) are the primary requirement to get register with the NTC Pakistan as the Engineering Technologist.  On the other hand, EC UK requires two years HND or three years Bachelors Engineering or Technology Degree for the title of Incorporated Engineer (IEng).


I would suggest that the EC UK should also upgrade the eligibility criteria for IEng as four years degree and change the title from IEng to Chartered Engineering Technologist (CET).  Its my point of view.  The Standards of other countries may also be compared other than Pakistan in this context.


Thank you.

Parents
  • 0
    Roy Bowdler:

    As someone who spent much of my career selecting and training, I am aware that relying on examination grades to select candidates for employment has dubious validity. I understand that if employers are potentially inundated with applications (as are some universities), then grading may help to filter down applications into a manageable number for further evaluation. There is also some correlation between higher grades and “intellectual potential” and/or “contentiousness” . However, I would expect responsible HR professionals to have a good working understanding of Occupational Psychology. I would also expect larger organisations to have carefully validated selection processes based on this. We are dealing here with potential to become an engineer in the organisation, not a proven track record of achievement in a relevant role.


    Hmmm...personally my experience has been that all too often grade requirements are not based on a validated process, rather from a mixture of gut instinct that higher grades must be best and a simple need to draw a line somewhere to develop a "long list" of applicants. I have had numerous "frank and free discussions" with various HR departments over the years who have wanted to introduce degree grade requirements into jobs for my team, without them actually understanding what the roles were. Practically, unless your company is the size of Google or Network Rail (to pick two random examples) I guess it's going to be hugely difficult to measure correlation between graduate grades and subsequent performance with any form of reliability and validity. 


    This is not to say that there isn't a correlation, just that I've never seen it demonstrated, not has anyone passed me details of studies that show such a correlation exists - I would be really interested to know of any. I will admit that I do have a personal gut (or experience) idea (rightly or wrongly!) of how the correlation between degree grades and subsequent performance as an engineer works - but then according to my own feel I shouldn't be doing the job I'm doing! Which at best goes to show that in any correlation there will always be outliers, which is why I really don't like blanket rules of "only people with xyz qualification can possibly be capable of engineering abc". So yes, I 100% agree with your first sentence Roy!!!


    If the IET had the funds to do it (maybe they do?) this would be a really useful area for them to fund a study into - how does qualification level at "graduation" (including apprentice routes) correspond to success as an engineer by role 5/10/15 years later. The challenge is - who would you survey? I don't have figures to hand for the retention rate of engineering graduates in the UK by their first employer, but I'm guessing (and I'll admit it is a guess) only about 20% stay there for five years? If this is anywhere near right, then employers wouldn't actually know how successful long term their recruitment strategy is in selecting good engineers - so I guess it would have to be a survey of engineers themselves?


    Of course this is much easier to determine in my part of the world, where graduates tend to stay with their first employer until retirement, redundancy or grim reaper, whichever comes first smiley Which focusses the mind when recruiting people. And explains why I used to worry far less about specific grades than whether I would be able to cope with working with this person for the next 25 years or more... 


    Cheers,


    Andy

Reply
  • 0
    Roy Bowdler:

    As someone who spent much of my career selecting and training, I am aware that relying on examination grades to select candidates for employment has dubious validity. I understand that if employers are potentially inundated with applications (as are some universities), then grading may help to filter down applications into a manageable number for further evaluation. There is also some correlation between higher grades and “intellectual potential” and/or “contentiousness” . However, I would expect responsible HR professionals to have a good working understanding of Occupational Psychology. I would also expect larger organisations to have carefully validated selection processes based on this. We are dealing here with potential to become an engineer in the organisation, not a proven track record of achievement in a relevant role.


    Hmmm...personally my experience has been that all too often grade requirements are not based on a validated process, rather from a mixture of gut instinct that higher grades must be best and a simple need to draw a line somewhere to develop a "long list" of applicants. I have had numerous "frank and free discussions" with various HR departments over the years who have wanted to introduce degree grade requirements into jobs for my team, without them actually understanding what the roles were. Practically, unless your company is the size of Google or Network Rail (to pick two random examples) I guess it's going to be hugely difficult to measure correlation between graduate grades and subsequent performance with any form of reliability and validity. 


    This is not to say that there isn't a correlation, just that I've never seen it demonstrated, not has anyone passed me details of studies that show such a correlation exists - I would be really interested to know of any. I will admit that I do have a personal gut (or experience) idea (rightly or wrongly!) of how the correlation between degree grades and subsequent performance as an engineer works - but then according to my own feel I shouldn't be doing the job I'm doing! Which at best goes to show that in any correlation there will always be outliers, which is why I really don't like blanket rules of "only people with xyz qualification can possibly be capable of engineering abc". So yes, I 100% agree with your first sentence Roy!!!


    If the IET had the funds to do it (maybe they do?) this would be a really useful area for them to fund a study into - how does qualification level at "graduation" (including apprentice routes) correspond to success as an engineer by role 5/10/15 years later. The challenge is - who would you survey? I don't have figures to hand for the retention rate of engineering graduates in the UK by their first employer, but I'm guessing (and I'll admit it is a guess) only about 20% stay there for five years? If this is anywhere near right, then employers wouldn't actually know how successful long term their recruitment strategy is in selecting good engineers - so I guess it would have to be a survey of engineers themselves?


    Of course this is much easier to determine in my part of the world, where graduates tend to stay with their first employer until retirement, redundancy or grim reaper, whichever comes first smiley Which focusses the mind when recruiting people. And explains why I used to worry far less about specific grades than whether I would be able to cope with working with this person for the next 25 years or more... 


    Cheers,


    Andy

Children
No Data

Join us to get the best from IET EngX.

Joining EngX lets you personalise your experience so you stay up to date on the topics that interest you, plus you’ll be able to make connections who are looking to collaborate, exchange ideas and more.

Join us Not now

Community Rules & Guidelines