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Pre-Payment Meter Standing Charges.

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If somebody moves into a new house and there are pre-paid meters as used by the previous owner, is the new owner responsible for any standing charges if no electricity or gas is consumed for a period of months? The new owner has not contracted with the energy suppliers in his own name or credited the meters with a key thingy.


Z.
  • 0
    The meters should have been read and the ownership of the debt clarified at the moment  the property changed hands.

    Otherwise, if you buy a house with a debt attached and just start to use the existing keys,  the electricity company are likely to come after the new owner for the existing debts.

    The Citizens advice Bureau say the following  

    Contact the current supplier straight away if your new home has a prepayment meter. Try not to use a key or card, or put any money on the meter, until you’ve done this. Otherwise you risk paying extra for debts owed by the people who lived there before you.



    If you do need to put money on the meter before you contact the current supplier, tell them this when you get in touch. They will pay you back for any extra charges you’ve paid, as long as you can prove when you moved in.



    Ask the supplier to:




    • take any debt off the meter so you don’t end up paying extra




    • give you a new prepayment key or card so you can put money on the meter



    ......




    Which makes it all sound so easy.


  • 0
    The answer is it depends. A meter with no credit left will start counting up a debt from the standing charge. 


    What happens here, is when someone moves out, we do a “clear down”. This results in the credit or debt in the meter being transferred to the key, leaving the meter with zero money. The key is then read and a final bill or credit invoice is produced, resulting in the customer either having to pay, or receiving the credit from the meter. Obviously with zero on the meter, there is no supply of electricity.


    When a new customer moves in, the new key will zero the debt on the meter (due to the standing charge), then transfer the money the customer has put on their new key to the meter, and the supply is restored. 


    There me are obviously other scenarios too. What people forget is that the key is “two way”. It takes credit to the meter, and also provides readings and other information back to the meter operator when the key has money added to it. You can think of a key meter as a smart meter, with the comma medium being the key. 


    Regards,


    Alan.
  • 0
    Hello

    The deemed contract includes both unit rates and standing charges.  Whoever moves in will be responsible for paying both from the point that they move in.  You should always read the meter and tell the supplier when you move in.

    With prepayment there is a little more complexity.


    There may be some credit on the meter.  If there is the supply will be on. If there isn't it will be off.  Strictly speaking this credit belongs to the outgoing occupier but is often just used up by whoever comes in.  That's another reason for reading the meter so the supplier can refund the outgoing customer.  Of course the outgoing customer may have provided readings to the supplier to facilitate this but you should always contact them with readings anyway - they need to know who to send the bill to and you need to be sure that the start position on your account is right.


    So if you just use the supply without contacting the supplier you are still liable for both standing charge and consumption at the rates in the supplier's deemed contract.  If there was no meter readings taken the supplier will estimate them and you will be stuck with them (assuming the estimate is reasonable).


    In order to put money 'in the meter' you need some form of card or key (unless its a newer/smart meter) which you take to a suitable shop and they apply credit when you hand over cash.  If the outgoing tenant doesn't leave this you cant put money on the meter.  If they do you can but you need to be aware that although the power will come on if you do this the money you pay over will be credited to the outgoing tenants account so you will pay twice!  Another reason for telling the supplier who will send either new keys/cards or reassign them to you.

    Finally, the meter may be set to recover a debt in which case the rates set in the meter will be higher than the contract rates so you will get less power

    for your money.


    All in all it makes sense to speak to the supplier and give meter readings on the day you move in.


    Hope this helps to clear the fog.

    Peter
  • 0
    Sch 6 of the Electricity Act 1989 indicates that the new owner or occupier is not responsible until electricity is supplied:

    Deemed contracts in certain cases

    3(1) Where an electricity supplier supplies electricity to any premises otherwise than in pursuance of a contract, the supplier shall be deemed to have contracted with the occupier (or the owner if the premises are unoccupied) for the supply of electricity as from the time (“the relevant time”) when he began so to supply electricity.


    The suppliers seem to be able to write the contract as they see fit.


    My supplier's terms (Scottish Power) in a deemed contract specify that an owner or occupier is liable for the contract subject to a minimum of two days' notice that he has ceased to be the owner or occupier, or that a new owner or occupier has entered into a contract.


    So in the OP, assuming that the supplier's contract is similar, it would seem that if the outgoing owner or occupier didn't notify the supplier, he will have remained liable for any standing charge. The new owner or occupier has no liability until something (anything at all) is turned on.
  • 0
    I believe this to be from an OFGEM source.


    "Example of supplier action  Suppliers waiving or reimbursing the standing charge when consumption has never taken place – All of the six largest suppliers have policies in place when dealing with households with zero gas consumption who are in vulnerable situations and are not on an express contract. EDF Energy, EON, npower, ScottishPower and SSE apply this policy to all gas households. EON has also extended this policy to all electricity consumers. British Gas will implement a new policy for dealing with households who are financially vulnerable, who have never used gas or electricity in their premises and are not on an express contract."


    Z.
  • 0
    I was given an EICR to carry out: firstly the key was at an estate agent that involved more cost unquoted for, that the owner refused to pay. When I arrived at the flat, there was a prepayment meter there with no credit, this meant no lighting and more importantly ......... no Zs: this could have been estimated but the owner now wanted me to top up the meter at a post office! I just walked away and returned the key. I have now doctored my quotes. 


    Jaymack

  • 0

    Jaymack:

    I was given an EICR to carry out: firstly the key was at an estate agent that involved more cost unquoted for, that the owner refused to pay. When I arrived at the flat, there was a prepayment meter there with no credit, this meant no lighting and more importantly ......... no Zs: this could have been estimated but the owner now wanted me to top up the meter at a post office! I just walked away and returned the key. I have now doctored my quotes. 


    Jaymack

      




    I would have done the same. Some people just try to take the piff.


    Z.

  • Former Community Member
    0 Former Community Member

    Jaymack:

    I was given an EICR to carry out: firstly the key was at an estate agent that involved more cost unquoted for, that the owner refused to pay. When I arrived at the flat, there was a prepayment meter there with no credit, this meant no lighting and more importantly ......... no Zs: this could have been estimated but the owner now wanted me to top up the meter at a post office! I just walked away and returned the key. I have now doctored my quotes. 


    Jaymack

      




    Hi Jaymack, is live testing is a requirement for an EICR, where a supply is not available it could just be a limitation that should be agreed with the person ordering the work? 

  • 0

    WB³:



    Hi Jaymack, is live testing is a requirement for an EICR, where a supply is not available it could just be a limitation that should be agreed with the person ordering the work? 


     




    That's a pretty major limitation. "Dear customer, it all checks out ok, except: I couldn't measure Ze so have no idea whether the supply provides a suitable earth, so the whole installation could be a death trap. Also I have no idea whether any of the RCDs work".

  • Former Community Member
    0 Former Community Member

    wallywombat:




    WB³:



    Hi Jaymack, is live testing is a requirement for an EICR, where a supply is not available it could just be a limitation that should be agreed with the person ordering the work? 


     




    That's a pretty major limitation. "Dear customer, it all checks out ok, except: I couldn't measure Ze so have no idea whether the supply provides a suitable earth, so the whole installation could be a death trap. Also I have no idea whether any of the RCDs work".


     




    Hi wally, it does happen, here is a previous IET forum topic: https://www2.theiet.org/forums/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=205&threadid=61131


    :)

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