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When is a spark an arc? OR - When is an arc a spark?

Just watched some chap on the E5 youtube channel visiting Eaton in Austria. Eaton AFDDs have been something of a subject of ridicule in youtubeland, with various respected electrical content providers demonstrating through various real-world means that they don't function. So, off this chap goes to Eaton's HQ in Vienna where they provide him with a aluminium case full of test kit, complete with the Eaton logo and fitted out with various Eaton devices inside.

One of the devices is the Eaton AFFDD which has famously failed to operate on numerous youtube video presentations.

Of course, it trips when tested with their own test kit. After all, no point in trying to sell something which isn't really needed unless you can demonstrate that it actually works, so Eaton helpfully provides the 'right' arc signature so that the device can trip on command in front of all those cynical doubters.


Apparently, all those heath robinson youtubers have been getting it wrong because they have unhelpfully been simulating real world arcing events which these devices won't actually pick up. You see, according to the 'experts' you need an arc instead of a spark to trip the device! What the hell is the difference?


Oh how I laughed! Is this how far they'll go to flog you some old tat you don't really need?

Just how many different arcs and sparks are there out there? Has anyone told David Attenborough of all these new species to explore?


Feel free to jump in!
Parents

  • Apparently, all those heath robinson youtubers have been getting it wrong because they have unhelpfully been simulating real world arcing events which these devices won't actually pick up.



     


    Come back when they're a fiver apiece and that they'll actually detect an intermittent fault on a hoover flex.






    Just a thought ... the device has to be practicable.


    But at the same time, it won't be if it nuisance-trips.


    The problem is, sparks (and perhaps arcs) are formed all the time in an electrical installation, for example when swtichgear and functional switching operates (light switches, relays in appliances and controls, etc.), and when carbon-brush motors are running. It would be no good at all if the device were continuously nuisance-tripping.


    Perhaps the real-world arcing events which have been simulated, in fact share the signature of some of "normal" events such as the ones described above, and this is the reason they are not detected by an AFDD.



    So, the question to answer is not whether a so-called "heath-robinson" sparking/arcing test operates the device, but whether there are events which are detected by devices to BS EN 62606, which will save lives.
Reply

  • Apparently, all those heath robinson youtubers have been getting it wrong because they have unhelpfully been simulating real world arcing events which these devices won't actually pick up.



     


    Come back when they're a fiver apiece and that they'll actually detect an intermittent fault on a hoover flex.






    Just a thought ... the device has to be practicable.


    But at the same time, it won't be if it nuisance-trips.


    The problem is, sparks (and perhaps arcs) are formed all the time in an electrical installation, for example when swtichgear and functional switching operates (light switches, relays in appliances and controls, etc.), and when carbon-brush motors are running. It would be no good at all if the device were continuously nuisance-tripping.


    Perhaps the real-world arcing events which have been simulated, in fact share the signature of some of "normal" events such as the ones described above, and this is the reason they are not detected by an AFDD.



    So, the question to answer is not whether a so-called "heath-robinson" sparking/arcing test operates the device, but whether there are events which are detected by devices to BS EN 62606, which will save lives.
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