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Minimum Voltage at incoming supply point

FlyWheel
Retired now and not up to date with reg’s since 16th. Helping advise a friend. Currently they have 100amp single phase supply and whilst the no load voltage is up at around 238 volts, as the circuit is loaded, voltage drops off substantially. Even with a load of 50 amps, ie, half the supply fuse rating, voltage is slightly below the -6% limit, at around 215 volts, further load simply pushes voltage significantly lower, and by extrapolating measured data, it would be nearer 170 volts with a load of 100 amps, is this acceptable? I plan measuring Ze and pfc this week as a guide perhaps to supply loop impedance and, which I suspect must be causing this excessive drop. I’m aware of the ESQCR reg’s although need to update myself, but are there any other regulations that apply?

  • 0
    When I politely asked for the MPR, I was severely reprimanded, He said he did not have to justify his data/calculations to me. What he misses is the massive help and support he would get if he disclosed such detail. But who are we?

    Regards, UKPN.
  • 0
    I consider that your posts have been somewhat abusive from the outset MKNP, and I responded accordingly. Thankfully, I have had a tremendous amount of help from others who have posted and am hopefully now back up to speed again near 10 years into retirement. As for the data asked for, it's probably not strictly relevant to the question I asked for advice on, and until I've had an opportunity to talk directly to the DNO (in response to my report to them), it's best that I don't talk numbers on a site like this as never know how many spies about, and how they may twist my answers, nor how they may want to use the data. As far as this load is concerned, I've had some amazing replies from a specialist heat pump forum, and it’s reminded me of what was day to day knowledge for me back then of drives and refrigeration systems and its basic theory generally. Particularly helpful today too has been a response on my associated post here on the IET forum page that one of the members who has also responded here, has given me, great stuff.
    Once I've had direct discussion with the DNO and agreed a way forward, I'll happily share the outcome with members of this site that are genuinely interested.


  • 0
    Thanks BOD, and you are right, I should stick to direct inbox discussion for off topic social chats, and will do this. As for further declaration of data re this particular friends installation, please see my latest response to MKNP. Thanks again for your input.
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    I'll give Scottish Power one thing, they are quick; but....

    From: GettingConnected@ScottishPower.com [mailto:GettingConnected@ScottishPower.com]
    Sent: 11 November 2019 15:11
    To: clive@xxxxxxx.uk

    Good Afternoon Mr Carver
    Thank you for your enquiry.
    Please be advised that we do not hold capacity information.
    We as the distributor would be responsible for upgrading the supply if this is required.
    An electrician would be able to advise what you have at the moment and if you require an upgrade.
    Please feel free to contact us if you would like to discuss this any further.
    Regards
    SP Energy Networks Contact Team
    320 St Vincent Street
    Glasgow
    G2 5AD


    I need to ask an Electrician, who do you suggest?    ?


    Clive




  • 0
    As I too am finding out, such questions can lead to a long drawn out iterative process, but perhaps they simply mean “get an electrician to check the size of their sealed fuse”!

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    UKPN:

    Our esteemed "adviser" won't feel the cold Kelly, there will be so much hot air around him.!!!???

    Regards, UKPN




    Lol had to laugh at that no offence meant to the OP

  • 0

    AncientMariner:

    I'll give Scottish Power one thing, they are quick; but....

    From: GettingConnected@ScottishPower.com [mailto:GettingConnected@ScottishPower.com]
    Sent: 11 November 2019 15:11
    To: clive@xxxxxxx.uk

    Good Afternoon Mr Carver
    Thank you for your enquiry.
    Please be advised that we do not hold capacity information.
    We as the distributor would be responsible for upgrading the supply if this is required.
    An electrician would be able to advise what you have at the moment and if you require an upgrade.
    Please feel free to contact us if you would like to discuss this any further.
    Regards
    SP Energy Networks Contact Team
    320 St Vincent Street
    Glasgow
    G2 5AD


    I need to ask an Electrician, who do you suggest?    ?




    The lack of DNO records seems remarkable. However, your contract is with the supplier (who, of course, may be one and the same) but in any event, one or the other of them ought to know.


    So you decide to sue your supplier over their failure to maintain the voltage. Their defence is that the ASC has been exceeded. I don't think that the Judge will be impressed if they can produce no evidence as to what was agreed.

  • 0
    Our contract is with Gulf Gas & Power UK.


    I responded to SP's email late Monday night, including:-

    Quote/...
    Grateful if you can please advise, how an Electrician "can advise what I have at the moment"?

    The Cut-Out fuse carrier may be marked 100A, but that does not mean that it contains a 100A fuse and my understanding is that the ASC and the actual Cut-Out fuse rating may not go hand in hand. In any case the Cut-Out is sealed.      I have been advised that this information is, or should be, held by the DNO.
    For info, our property was built circa 1959, no mains gas, heating by open coal fires.  Later, pre 1970 three storage heaters were installed on an Off-Peak tariff.

    .../unquote.


    The storage heaters were removed 2002 as was the Off Peak meter and time switch and the cut out and meter moved into a built in meter box (via split-con on the cut end of the PILC supply cable, TN-S earthing. Gas fired CH was installed during building works.


    Anyway, nothing has come back so far (pm 12th) from SP.


    Clive

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    Great response Clive, and I’m following with interest.

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    Reply from SP this morning:-

    Quote/...
    Good Morning Clive,
    Thank you for your recent email.
    We only hold records for half hourly supplys.
    In order to asess what is in the property we would recommend applying for an additional load so that we can carry out a network study and advise you on the current capacity.
    If you require any further assistance please do not hesitate to contact us.
    Kind regards
    SP Energy Networks Contact Team
    Lister Drive
    Liverpool
    L13 7HJ
    0845 270 0783

    .../unquote.


    Actually, looking at the ESQCR http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2002/2665/contents/made 

    Information to be provided on request:-


    28. A distributor shall provide, in respect of any existing or proposed consumer’s installation

    which is connected or is to be connected to his network, to any person who can show a reasonable

    cause for requiring the information, a written statement of—

    (a) the maximum prospective short circuit current at the supply terminals;

    (b) for low voltage connections, the maximum earth loop impedance of the earth fault path

    outside the installation;

    (c) the type and rating of the distributor’s protective device or devices nearest to the supply

    terminals;

    (d) the type of earthing system applicable to the connection; and

    (e) the information specified in regulation 27(1),

    which apply, or will apply, to that installation.

     

    27.—(1) Before commencing a supply to a consumer’s installation, or when the existing supply characteristics have been modified, the supplier shall ascertain from the distributor and then declare to the consumer—




    (a)the number of phases;




    (b)the frequency; and




    (c)the voltage,


    So it would seem that the ASC is not something that the DNO should know?  That sort of implies that you can have what the cut-out fuse will allow? Perhaps as in using the words that some mobile phone operators use  to sell data say, "All you can eat" !


    Strange though their reference to half hourly metering, we have half hourly metering in our village hall, but I thought that was a supplier thing, rather than the DNO?


    Clive

     


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