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Wrong kind of electric. Part II.

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  • So, an E-Block/Transistor 9V Alkaline Battery is simply a rectangular battery that fits in a 1970’s radio, that’s almost a disappointment as I expecting it to have almost magical properties.


    The alarms communicate with each other by varying the voltage on the signal wire, so if the battery doesn’t have stable voltage presumably there will be issues. It seems hardwired interconnections are now dated, as wireless interconnections allow far more information to be shared between the alarms.


     Andy Betteridge
  • Wrong kind of electric part I.
  • mapj1:

     This sketch then .. actually   'ever cell' to avoid any sort of lawsuit from battery makers.

    .....

    They are not supposed to be recharged, but with careful control of waveform they can be used several times.


    That is the sketch - not surprised I couldn't remember the details completely correctly as it is more than thirty years since I saw it. Many thanks for the link.


    I agree with you about the recharging. I discovered many years ago you could recharge many supposedly single use batteries, but unless you have the right facilities to do the charging safely the cost benefit/risk balance just doesn't weigh up.


  • Alkaline batteries are reccomended for smoke alarms for the following reasons.


    A zinc carbon battery will work fine, but has a shorter life, increasing the risk of a dead battery when called upon. Greatly increases labour costs if someone is paid to replace batteries.


    The cheaper rechargeable batteries (6 cell, 7.2 volt) will give frequent low battery alarms. The better type of rechargeable batteries (7 cell, 8.4 volt) work better. The average tenant is unable to master rechargeables. Also the voltage drops relatively quickly at end of life and wont give the low battery alarm for long.


    Disposable lithium 9 volt batteries (3 lithium manganese dioxide cells, true 9 volts) work fine but are too expensive for general use, and also suffer from sudden death.

    Lithium batteries have the merit of extreme shelf life and freedom from leakage, useful for test instruments etc. Little advantage for a smoke alarm.
  • Sparkingchip:
    Wrong kind of electric part I.


    I must have missed that first time, but the issue rang a bell. Oddly enough, very recently a colleague (no really, not me this time) has only recently released the magic smoke from some mains powered kit by using it from an inverter with less than sinusoidal output.


    On investigation, the failed unit used a power supply circuit that was transformerless, using a capacitive dropper from mains with a small series resistor  and  some diodes to create a low current DC supply for an LCD and some other bits and bobs for logging.


    Clearly with  a sine wave the capacitor does its thing (X= 1/(2.pi.F.C)), and the current flowing in the C and the rest of the power supply is almost a sine wave, and all is hunky dory.

    When the supply has step-like edges however, then the current in the capacitor takes the form of a series of very short duration high current surges, one surge per voltage  step, and the dissipation in series resistance is then very 'peaky', almost like the shock of an inrush event each half cycle.

    Replacing the R with a higher wattage one restored some normality, but it had folk standing about and thinking for a few minutes.


    If the smoke alarms in that post use the mains in a similar way, they also may not appreciate the near vertical sides (high rate of change of voltage) that some inverter designs produce.


     


  • Yes Mike, but you also need to remember the "F" in the equation above. When the inverter output is a sine wave made of many short rectangular pulses, the F is several kHz, not 50 Hz so the capacitor reactance is much smaller = much higher current! Again it's the mA which is dangerous, not the volts!