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Broken lens on PIR security light EICR code

Former Community Member
Former Community Member

Hi 

 

Working on a property today and one of the issues was a PIR light not working, this was resoled by bending the lamp connections. But I noticed the lense on the on the PIR was old and cracked, trying to make my mind up between C2 and C3. Owners are selling soon and the property hasn't been touched for 16 years and will need some renovation by the next owners.

The light is at about 3m and out of reach, earthed and protected by an RCD. It's a halogen light therefore presumably the PIR is switching 240V and the PIR is at the bottom, I suspect if any water does enter it will run out before getting to the electrics. The electrics certainly seemed to be working, I didn't dig too deep as I suspect it would have lead to the lense breaking.

Looking at NAPIT code breakers below the crux of the matter is, is it likely to lead to potential danger. Given the above I am leaning towards it being unlikely to cause potential danger and a  C3.

What are your opinions?

 

Thanks

 

Alan

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    davezawadi (David Stone): 
     

    Are live terminals exposed? That is 410.3.5, not anything else. This situation is something which could develop in time to be a danger but is not at present. You simply point out that this could happen, but at present it is safe.

    Let's examine your car as clearly the electrical case is too complex to understand.

    The brake pads are only 3mm thick now, so I suggest you may like to change them fairly soon. Is the car AS IT STANDS dangerous? Not in any way! The brake fluid is old and has not been changed for a couple of years, it would be wise to change it soon as it is hygroscopic, which might affect performance.  The brakes test just fine. Is the car AS IT STANDS dangerous? Not in any way! 

    You are inspecting an installation AS IT STANDS, and you may think it might deteriorate. Act as above, this is not some kind of guessing game. Following this “game” actually makes everything dangerous, it is not as proved by the very low accident rate, you need to understand relative risk. It can never be zero. That is why EICRs are difficult for the inexperienced or inadequate. It is easy as pie to over code everything, see “danger” everywhere, but in reality, this is not honest or professional. If you really want to see inadequacy the other way try watching the (live or recorded on Youtube) Grenfell enquiry, it is appalling. You will see people with false qualifications or inadequate experience trying to do a difficult assessment of safety. It has made me realise even more that an EICR is a difficult job attempted very badly by the under qualified and experienced.

    So if an deteriorated electrical item is likely to fail, and perhaps dangerously, we ignore it do we? Not me. I will record it as not being satisfactory, to cover my back.

    If an incident occurred in the future, I might be accused of not recording that potential danger when I previously could. That could lead to serious trouble.

    I don't like the idea of using my car with thin minimum depth brake pads. That's chancing things just too much. I believe in preventative maintenance.

     

    651.1. “In order to determine, as far as is reasonably practicable, whether the installation is in a satisfactory condition  FOR CONTINUED SERVICE”

     

    The broken leans will not self heal on the P.I.R. detector, but it will deteriorate more. 615.2  (v) and (vi).

     

    “Live parts shall be completely covered with insulation….” 416.1

    Z.

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  • 0

    davezawadi (David Stone): 
     

    Are live terminals exposed? That is 410.3.5, not anything else. This situation is something which could develop in time to be a danger but is not at present. You simply point out that this could happen, but at present it is safe.

    Let's examine your car as clearly the electrical case is too complex to understand.

    The brake pads are only 3mm thick now, so I suggest you may like to change them fairly soon. Is the car AS IT STANDS dangerous? Not in any way! The brake fluid is old and has not been changed for a couple of years, it would be wise to change it soon as it is hygroscopic, which might affect performance.  The brakes test just fine. Is the car AS IT STANDS dangerous? Not in any way! 

    You are inspecting an installation AS IT STANDS, and you may think it might deteriorate. Act as above, this is not some kind of guessing game. Following this “game” actually makes everything dangerous, it is not as proved by the very low accident rate, you need to understand relative risk. It can never be zero. That is why EICRs are difficult for the inexperienced or inadequate. It is easy as pie to over code everything, see “danger” everywhere, but in reality, this is not honest or professional. If you really want to see inadequacy the other way try watching the (live or recorded on Youtube) Grenfell enquiry, it is appalling. You will see people with false qualifications or inadequate experience trying to do a difficult assessment of safety. It has made me realise even more that an EICR is a difficult job attempted very badly by the under qualified and experienced.

    So if an deteriorated electrical item is likely to fail, and perhaps dangerously, we ignore it do we? Not me. I will record it as not being satisfactory, to cover my back.

    If an incident occurred in the future, I might be accused of not recording that potential danger when I previously could. That could lead to serious trouble.

    I don't like the idea of using my car with thin minimum depth brake pads. That's chancing things just too much. I believe in preventative maintenance.

     

    651.1. “In order to determine, as far as is reasonably practicable, whether the installation is in a satisfactory condition  FOR CONTINUED SERVICE”

     

    The broken leans will not self heal on the P.I.R. detector, but it will deteriorate more. 615.2  (v) and (vi).

     

    “Live parts shall be completely covered with insulation….” 416.1

    Z.

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