Help wanted to read/understand an electrical supply plan from DNO - updated new query

BOD's having a nap - BED?


If only Chris! It won't be long though...........


OBW et al.


Where overlay reinforcement to many other users are carried out, it is normally done as part of their capital infrastructure budget.


Where say a "housing estate" is newly built, the cost of a new electric service is mostly allocated to the developer as part of his building costs and when split between a quantity, it is a small proportion of each plot build cost. A "savvy" developer has a team that would have ascertained the cost of all necessary services (electric, gas, water, sewage, phone) and taken this into account when bidding/agreeing a price for the potential plots.


I'm aware of customer "contributions" but these tend to be where there is the possibility of subsequent users being newly connected, so the original contribution has a clause that "refunds" part of the original cost as they recognise that it is unfair that someone should pay a large proportion of a new distribution network only for a newcomer to have their connection for the standard fee.


Your example does seem unusual and sight of the application form you or your electrician/advisor sent in would be useful.


Feel free to PM me but I do need my sleep (as alluded to above!) and working tomorrow where mobile reception is patchy, but will be back to civilisation in the evening.


Regards


BOD

thanks BOD! Don't want to keep you from your bed...?


I am a self-builder, so just the one house. I had budgeted about £5k for an electricity connection, so this quote came as rather a shock (no pun intended ?)


I made my application through an online portal on WPD's website (I don't think it's possible to obtain a copy) and received back a quote/letter of offer with the proposal as set out on the plan attached at the top. I subsequently had a telephone call from the very pleasant chap who had done the legwork and had come up with the proposal.


I asked a lot of questions about why/how this was necessary for my modest supply to be met, and didn't really get a very satisfactory answer to that beyond 'I put in the information and this is what it comes back with'. It was difficult to get an answer to the question about why our proportion of this work would cost 70% of the total. He said something like 'we put in all of the numbers, and the remainder (30%) is the leftover capacity after you have been connected'. This makes no sense to me as all of the houses in the street seem to come from one modest cable, and we would be putting in a much larger cable. We can't be using the majority of that supply ourselves.


I am keen to understand whether the supply was already in need of an upgrade, and this is an opportunity for WPD to do that work at largely my expense. If so, I would go back and contest the quote.  As someone else has suggested, it might be a lot less for me to have a supply direct from the Tx 60m to the north of my plot.


Sleep well,

M

perspicacious‍ I don't have the right settings to be able to message you. Do you know how I can do that?

Thanks

M

Hello

Its quite hard to follow all the detail on the drawing and without more local knowledge about the network it is quite hard to comment..... nevertheless a few questions come to mind.


Firstly WPD appear to want to dig across the road to lay a new duct to accommodate the overlay 300mm2 cable. On the existing plan there appears to be a duct there already with the 95mm2 cable in it.  Of course it may be blocked or have collapsed but equally it could be open.  It should be possible to reuse this duct (or at least attempt to) and this would save the (substantial) costs of digging the road up.  


Secondly whilst it may be a good engineering solution and help to alleviate other capacity problems (sounds like the existing 95mm2 cable could be overloaded) to overlay the entire length of the existing 95mm2 cable an alternative would be to lay new cable from the substation to the new property.  This could be on a much shorter route if wayleaves can be got to cross the land between the new garage and the corner north of it.  I suspect the substation is pole mounted so providing a new fuse way shouldn't be an issue (if it was ground mounted then its quite possible that the fuse cabinet would be full). It might be possible to T off one of the other LV mains near the substation as an alternative but that will depend on how near to capacity they are.  I think you'd have to pay 100% rather than 70% but you would be looking at a much shorter run and prob a 95mm2 rather than 300mm2 cable and no road crossing, no breeches joint, n need for 2 services joints and 2 service extension joints and no need for one of the pole terminations and much less of your own digging.  It could be even less if you can persuade WPD to run overhead but I expect they would resist this.


Thirdly, If you took the latter approach the laying of the new cable to the substation would be contestable works and you could find alternative contractor to quote for this which might save money too.


I would try and find someone local with connections experience who will talk to WPD for you. They have a duty to consider the lowest cost way of connecting you.


Finally all of the DNOs are preparing business plans for the next regulatory period at present.  These will be reviewed by the independent WPD Customer Engagement Group who I am sure would be interested to hear about your experience.  Connections are a focus for them.


Hope this helps.

statter‍ , thank you so much for this fantastically helpful reply. What a plethora of good points and good ideas. 


I will definitely be looking for a local person with connections experience who could discuss with WPD, and will be looking for the relevant piece of legislation which I can use to persuade WPD that they have a duty to assist me, rather than getting me to assist them in upgrading their network.


I shall also get in touch with the Customer Engagement Group to share my experience.

Many thanks indeed!

Morgan

Thirdly, If you took the latter approach the laying of the new cable to the substation would be contestable works and you could find alternative contractor to quote for this which might save money too.


I support first and second but I'd advise against trying to engage other than WPD to undertake the contestable works as I doubt if they would be able to be any cheaper, plus you'd end up trying to coordinate the two parties where dealing with just one can be difficult at times. I'm fairly sure there are additional overseeing/approval costs imposed if you "shop elsewhere", Although, I've got to say, I've always had a good relationship with WPD in particular.


As to messages, I'm not very good but I think you'll need to explore the bell symbol at the top right of the page.


Regards


BOD

Hello Morgan

This is a good  source of policy on connections https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/ofgem-publications/87259/guideelectricitydistributionconnectionspolicy.pdf


The following paras are the key ones.... (bold / underline text is my highlight)


4.1. A connection offer made under section 16 of the act will inform the customer of the charge it will have to pay. If a DNO is providing the connection the charge will be based on the cost of the “minimum scheme”.


4.2. The minimum scheme is the solution designed solely to provide the capacity needed for the new connection at the lowest overall capital cost. A DNO may design an enhanced scheme,2 but the cost to the customer will not exceed that of the minimum scheme. The customer can also request work in excess of the minimum scheme where it thinks this would be more beneficial. For example, it may decide that a more expensive route to the existing network will receive planning permission more easily and is therefore worth paying for. The customer will need to pay the full cost of this additional work, including the cost of operating and maintaining these additional assets over their lifetime.


I expect that the 70% is WPD interpretation of the costs of the minimum scheme but I would push them as my previous note.  Good luck.